iMore show 442: Photos for Mac beta!

by birtanpublished on November 23, 2020

The I'm our show is brought to you today by is like the matrix for your brain it just injects knowledge directly into your system it is it is the best thing ever and we have right now a special offer if you want to invest in yourself if you want to make this the best 2015 ever the best year ever happens to be 2015 all you have to do is sign up for a free 10-day trial to by visiting Linda calm / I more go ahead we challenge you to learn something new in 2015 thanks Linda it is februari 6 2015 I'm Rene Ritchie and right now we're going to talk about photos for Mac a lot a lot this aligns

The I more show that was a voice of serenity Caldwell how are you Ren hi I'm doing good um I am finally not sick oh my gosh it's only been a month yes oh yeah that was a vicious vicious vicious thing you beat up there it was I blame CES yeah dastardly CES see yes in the holiday that seems like when you put those two things together no good can come of it no sir so a leak as moja is on special assignment and I screwed up the times Peter said he would be free at three I forgot because we usually do the show at two and here we are we just messed up that's okay we can that we can

Improvise we can talk photos God knows we've uh we've been buried a lot in the last 18 hours yeah so what happened is Apple dropped the OS 10 10 point 10.3 beta for developers and as part of that came the photos for mac beta yes um which I actually I just this week i was thinking like i should write a whistle wish list about my photos for mac experience because i'm sure it's coming out soon and lo and behold apparently apple was reading my mind because photos for mac is not necessarily quite here yet but uh but there's a beta there's a beta and it's remarkably solid for a

Developer beta this is true some people were wondering it you know the Apple was updating their website what happened to photos and wasn't going to be late were they going to not do it and there was a little bit of internet angst I think this sort of calms it makes people are really excited everyone wants it but it makes people calm down a little bit too about whether they're getting it or not yeah it's like it's okay people Apple is not eliminating photos from its idea of you know the future of the internet and web I mean you've you've got it on your iPhone it's a good bet

That it's gonna make its way back over to the Mac no one panic like very key is not coming to your house and deleting all your photos deadly delete delete only if he says Cybermen yeah um no the photos the photos beta is here and it looks a very similar to I think what we were expecting it to look like it it has a lot of sort of interface resembling iOS um it has some of the features that you know and love from iPhoto like faces it has some of the features you know and love from aptor like some better better editing controls in this nice beautiful iOS 8 OS 10 Yosemite design style yeah

It's adjusted so I guess right off the top it's only available for developers right now right and get it any other way no you have to have a Mac developer's license and for average folks I would not suggest that you pony up a hundred dollars just so you get easy act or early access to photos because a it is a beta and you don't want to be using your primary photo or your primary photos with this beta and be Apple has announced that they're going to do a public beta later on this year via its apple seed program so if you want to get early access to photos and you don't

Have a developer license and you don't have a backup libraries or a separate Mac to test 10 10 3 on wait until the developer beta or wait until the public beta it'll probably come out in the next couple months put yourself on the list now so you don't forget yeah if Peter were here you would say should I be beta testing this on my main photo library hell no hell no no I mean I'm testing I'm testing on a portion of my main library but that is also Tripoli backed up on iCloud photo library on dropbox crashplan yeah no it's better safe than sorry it really does mean beta beta and

Spring spring could be any time up until June I guess but it feels like an April emai thing to me yeah well you start the problem is we've got a we've got some sections for Apple to slot out in their calendar right and we're pretty sure that March April is probably going to be the watch deadline because watch was Apple watch was said to be released in early 2015 and we've heard Tim Cook's uh you know back back room magic guising about scheduling and early means the first four months of the year so I Apple watch no later than April um so we've got that slotted in

And then June we've got the worldwide developers conference so unless they're gonna wait all the way till summer which I highly do because it's apple an apple wants to release their you know different magical fun things at dub dub DC including the next version of OS 10 I'm guessing we'll probably see it mid to late april may be early May yeah that'll fit that the spring narrative really nicely mm-hmm maybe I just just for fun I went and looked up official definitions of spring and it looks like in most civilized parts of the world they agree that that you know tapers off

And towards the end of may beginning of June yeah it may not be quite the summer solstice yet but um rest assured I think I think Apple knows has a good idea of when the springtime is just like they have a good idea of when early mid and late is so we were getting so many questions just so so many hmm so first off I guess people are worried people who use iPhoto now or use aperture now are worried that they're going to get photos and then their stuffs going to get taken away but it looks like apples done at least as much as is humanly possible to make the migration smooth

And to get as much of your stuff in there in one way shape or form at least yeah I mean the thing to know if you are an iphoto user will start with iPhoto and then we'll go over to aperture if you are an iphoto user um when you open photos for Mac your ass you're either asked to automatically import the library of your choice if you have multiple libraries or it just automatically imports your library and notice I say import and not transfer or you know transcode because there are two separate libraries photos does not replace your iPhoto library so if for

Some reason you want to consider you continue using photos or continue using actor for that matter you can and notice I said multiple libraries multiple library support still exists info so if you want to have a library separate from your work library or you want you know you want to keep a special library full of like ridiculous pictures that you don't want on the internet memes or something you can do that that's that's easy it's not super complicated same thing as before you just option click on or control click on the no option option click that was

Right the first time on the app like on the the app icon so that's that's all taken care of um when you get as an iphoto user getting into photos it's basically like photos got or iPhoto got a very fast makeover um so it's much speedier and much less processor intensive than I photo is i'm running a naught 20 2013 macbook air 2014 macbook air and my computer on iphoto is a pain despite the fact that it's much a much better processor than my original 2010 macbook air it was still a pain and trying to edit photos meant life waiting for the beach ball to go around it was

Like I just could not consider doing any kind of photo management on my macbook air with photos for Mac it does not feel like I'm using a macbook air it feels like i'm using my big heavy duty iMac which is awesome um so speed improvements very much of a thumbs up I don't know how you found it but for me it was very similar to the experience of the first time I used mobile safari because it would just go and it wouldn't stop and render as you went like you know Android did that for a while so the older phones did that you you'd be trying to scroll and they'd be trying to

Render and there was no priority between performance and and between interface and actions and Apple just made sure that the interface always moved and then it would stop and render when you paused and that's what photos feels like if you go super fast you can see that the images aren't rendering fully as you go by there's sort of lower res oars or thumbnail images and then as you pause those images come become super sharp and detailed and it feels like they're doing everything possible to make the workload as light as possible so that interface can just fly and I notice it not just

Compared to iPhoto but compared to aperture it just it just really moves now I don't have terabytes of stuff in there but Apple did say that they built it to scale because they realize that people do have tear bytes of data no yeah I mean I think when I photo was originally created they were you know this this was a time pretty smart phones went the idea of having 10,000 pictures a year was not necessarily the goal of the average user maybe your pro had 10,000 20,000 photos in their library but the average user probably had like five hundred thousand

Digital photos they're not that big right and then as I photo grew it it started to come under severe strain under its back end when when everybody basically started getting bigger libraries 10 20 30 40 gigabyte photo libraries photos at least for I have about 80 90 gigs in my photos library the testing library that I have right now and photos no major flags there are a couple of bugs in the developer program that like cause insta crashes but aside from that um it actually like scrolling feels smooth it's exactly what you were saying about Safari Renee it

Just it feels fluid it doesn't feel jerky it doesn't feel like you have a subpar computer if you're have a computer that's slightly slower it just less fewer things render um it's and and the editing screen is actually is so much faster than I photo and aperture for that matter again hmm for people who are coming from aperture or people who have been using both iPhoto and aperture there's a couple gotchas I think like you have to it doesn't do Flags it doesn't do stars and it doesn't do one other thing yeah well there are a couple of sort of translations that you will

Find moving from iPhoto to photos is not that big of a deal on your events an organization gets transferred into folders and albums so there is hierarchical organization and there is a hidden sidebar that you can pull out and reorganize and drag and drop and all of that so people who want to have super hyper organized libraries can do so and smart albums are still there but like you were saying Renee there are specific organization features like custom metadata and flags and stars have all been sort of translated into the tank architecture so I think Apple just you

Know it was a lot of it was a lot of stuff it was a lot of drunks basic yeah corrupt no it's a lot of different ways to organize things I think a bowl just wants to kind of consolidate similarly places in in iphoto is gone in photos for Mac I don't necessarily think that geo-tagging will disappear forever I imagine it's a feature that they want to add back at some point in the future but for now if you have geotagged photos they show up in your library in the under the info pane you can see where the geotag is but you can't add new geo tags and you can't change geo tags and

You can't create smart albums based on location there is again there's like a pseudo places atmosphere in that if you go into moments view and you click on a specific place in moments it will pop up the map of the United States and it'll show you like little clusters here and there of pre geotagged photos basically anything that comes off of here one of these guys one of your phones and the search got way smarter too so for example you had something five stars or one stars in aperture you can type 1 star or five star and I'll search for that keyword if you type in a location

Like California or cupertino it'll show you everything all the photos from that area so search it's like it is on iOS a little bit spot lady but it is much better than it was before and it's much better than iOS to there are many more commands that you can use um other things that search by face it's true can you can search by face and the faces architecture is there for people who are worried it's a pseudo smart album it's done um I don't know if it's quite finished being baked yet but there is an option to sort of look through your untagged faces they appear in like six

Bubbles at a time on and there's option to tag faces to untag faces all of that is you know and well in love the keyboard mannat or the key the key word manager is still there so you can quickly tagged and untagged photos the biggest thing i think for aperture users is obviously there's going to be a difference a difference in hierarchical organizational design because you don't have stats but i think i think folders and album should be okay because you can still nest what you want there but also you're looking at a severe kind of just like we

Saw in Final Cut Pro to Final Cut Pro 10 and the new version of iMovie there's a bit of a been a bit of a drawback across the board so the the new editing tools and photos are very fast very smart and they're there's a surprising amount of good ones like if I'm just if I pull it up right now you know and I'm I'm editing a photo you've got your basic your basic light your basic color your basic black and white sliders that you see an iphoto but you can also of course drop down into the advanced version of those views so you can get you know if I drop down on light I can individually

Adjust the exposure and the highlights the shadow the brightness the contrast with a slider but you can add additional adjustments so people who are used to working with say a histogram or levels or white balance or they want to define or reduce noise or sharpen their image there are additional little sliders for that that allow you to really see what's going on in the photo but that does like with all of that really really awesome sort of features packed packed away in there you are losing things from a pitcher you're losing the loop you're losing brushes you're losing plugins

Right now although I suspect we may see plug-in architecture becoming available down the road but it's one of those things where I'm like based on the based on the baseline architecture that Apple has put together with a Photos app and based on their reputation with creative applications and what they've been doing over the last six seven years now rewriting their core application base we got to assume that it's going to start very skin deep and then they're going to build down the most important thing for photos right now is building a next-generation back end so that it can

Actually hold your photo library and not be sluggish and you know because it's what's what's the point in having 10 million brushes and being able to you know add whatever plugin you want if the library and the management is so slow that it makes you want to tear your hair out yeah I photo an aperture both were not of the iphone age like you said they were no the iCloud age they were very much relics they were they were legacy code bases apple took them really really far but it was pretty clear that they couldn't take them any further and this starts fresh this gives them a

Whole new interface and it gives them a whole new architecture and just what you were talking about the editing tools I find that with this entire app it's really really hard to make an app that appeals to a wide range of people you know someone like if I'm brand new to photography and I got my first iphone and I just wanted to do with the photos or if I've been doing it for years and I have a DSLR it's a huge range and expectations and requirements and what Apple's done is like this concept of depth we're on the interface you start off and all you have is a very clean

Slate all you see is the thumbnails of your images yes you can pull up the sidebar if you you know if you're old school like that you can open up the editing pain and you can just see a few controls but you can also add the histogram you can add the detail controls you can add noise reduction you can add all these things back so you can take it from being an incredibly streamlined incredibly simple interface that's really easy to use with magic wands for editing magic wands for you know lining on the horizon all these super easy tools all the way up to

Sidebars and thumbnail bars and histograms and you know individual contrast and color and saturation and sharpness and and white balance that's it's not going to go all the way up to a pro photographer but I think it's going to cover a lot of from brand new people to like serious enthusiasts yeah I'm I'm really impressed with you know it's I'm been a longtime proponent of Falco Pro 10 to some of my media friends kind of dismay there like how how do you support this thing it took away all of our tools but you know Apple is not as committed to the creative professional as they

Once were that's just a fact you know they don't rely on the creative professionals to sell Macintoshes the way they did in the 90s but that doesn't mean that Apple's completely forgotten about the creative professional it just means that they've slightly adjusted their scope to basically Apple wants to create have more creative professionals Apple wants to introduce people into the world of the creative professional they don't necessarily want to take on Photoshop or Adobe or or avid anymore um and I while I think that you know Final Cut Pro X Final Cut Pro 10

Can can you know has the potential to be a heavy hitter in the film editing industry I think what is more important about it is that it gives the intermediaries the film school students folks like that a good a good building block on what film editing really is and that's the same my same feeling with for the Photos app right now is that with photos it gives you dead simple controls as well as that drop down so you can physically see what's happening with your photo um one of the best photography classes I ever took was actually when I was abroad in France I

Was working with a friend of mine who was a pro photographer and the way that he taught me to use um you know aperture mode and and get used to using manual was basically like all right we're gonna sort of take it one step at a time we're going to build things on top of each other and you know within a day I was shooting manual and I didn't realize it because I had just been like okay I'll fit a little bit with this okay that makes sense okay I'll fiddle a little bit with this and then all of a sudden I'm like oh my god i'm using all of these tools and they're not scary how

Did that happen so I it's that's something that I think that Apple can do really really well is put together put together a suite of software that allows people who are not necessarily bare-bones beginners put on you know even them to to take charge of their photos their videos to not have their photos just be those things they take once because I think it would be a good picture and then it gets lost in to the Aeon of time um I just I think they're making a really good sort of concerted stabbed in it and it's certainly you know photos for Mac is not pro

Photography software it's not um it might get to a point where it's you know prosumer and it might even serve some pro audiences but if you need superpro photography organization you might still need Lightroom it's just but that's not you know I don't think that's most people yeah I think I think that's really really true mean taking it down you know I don't to get 20 on too much of a tangent but the iphone you can buy an iphone and just use it to play music to take photographs and to talk on the phone you don't have to know anything

About control center or notification center or extend stability or continuity or anything you can just use it at the most primary level possible and you can do the same thing with an iPad you can use that as a web browser in a video of you or an e-book reader if you want to and I feel like this is the same if you can just use this to pull in your photos go there hit the magic wand hit the thing or if you want to use the sliders they make a lot of sense like all you know is I want to make it lighter or darker I want to make it more or less in like you know colorful I want to slide

Around the black and white options super super easy but if you want to you can drill down you can open those panels and you can go in there and you can adjust it at the microscale and I think that's super clever because you exactly to your point it doesn't cater to power users but it really does empower users and if Apple does add extensibility the photo extensions like we see an iOS and if they do add continuity so you can do handoff like like you can with some of the other apps that starts to get really powerful and yeah maybe it won't be photoshop but you know Photoshop does a

Lot of things and something that that's why I don't be made Lightroom because sometimes it's good to have dedicated stuff and I think this will hit a huge it will hit that sweet eighty percent that Apple typically targets yeah I I think there are only a lot of excited people ready to use photos for mac and I'm looking forward to kind of see in seeing exactly how they're going to market this I'm sure there's going to be an adorable like very colorful commercial but yeah it's I think one thing you've said is like this there are still features clearly missing from here

We have we've seen enough no indication that this will support handoff which seems to me like you know if you're if you're going to support you know if you're going to build a ground-up reinvention of your photo software it would be pretty cool if you could you know hand off in the middle of doing edits but there are just like I movie unfortunately there are things on that you can do on photos for Mac that aren't supported right now on iOS that includes the is smart album that also includes smart albums in general which I you know I

That's been one of my long wish lists for iOS is to have smart albums right now it doesn't even look like folders or sinking per se the same folders appear on both mac and iOS when you first when you first connect to iCloud photo library but I haven't as yet been able to get one folder to go to the other device and who knows how much of that is beta and how much of that is exactly exactly so it's one of those things where I've got to assume that some of these things are coming down the path so I would advise anybody who's kind of like paying attention to photos for Mac

You know we're right now sort of keeping an ongoing faq about what we've discovered in it but just um you know be aware that's an early beta and then if something isn't working right now like for instance there's no there's no detect dupes in the library there's an detect dupes you know at the at the initial stage where you're importing your photos but they're like that that field doesn't exist open in another program doesn't currently exist there are things here that you know we might see improve along the line and I just want to urge people to not get to

Panicky if you like this feature isn't here my life is ruined because the thing is you can still use iPhoto and you can still use aperture Apple isn't like pressing the doomed button on each of them as soon as they launch photos for Mac into the real world you can still keep on using them it's just you know they're they're gonna die out eventually because they're not going to be continued to be updated just like Final Cut Final Cut Pro 7 was you know kind of living it along they work on Yosemite but there's no indication like and you can use Yosemite for a long time to look

At yeah the thing I noticed why used to use open in in aperture a lot because I I spent my entire life in Photoshop so it was easier for me to just open in Photoshop for every photo and I never ended up using much of aperture at all much too you know the consternation of my photography friends with iphoto you know I never did that I just grabbed the photo and drag it into Photoshop and that just works in photos and for anything that I need to pixel at it as a one-off I can still do that there's no change there's no real change when it comes to photos from me so I think again

That that I photos thing is pretty cool but the way so I'm just going through your faq your serenity didn't really amazing frequently asked questions post and will link to it in the show notes but the other thing you point out is that this is this is inextricably linked into iCloud photo library part of the whole point of having photos is this tie into the also in beta iCloud photo library mm-hmm absolutely an iCloud photo library does a fantastic fantastic job unifying photos you know it said we it's kind of been limping along right now in

That we have it on the phone and we sort of have it and very limited beta on the web but couldn't upload Ross and it all lived on your phone it was just it was a not not the best solution so having it tied to the mac and having being able to have like a strong repository for your photos both on your hard drive and up in the cloud iphoto iCloud photo library is doing things sort of similar to dropbox where it's going to let you have the option to store all of your photos locally if you have a hard drive big enough or an external hard drive big enough photos does support external

Projects or external libraries you can store everything on your Mac or on an external drive if you want but they also have the optimized storage option which I actually think is really you know I was very against optimized storage when it showed up on the phone wondering why oh god well because it's it you know it's like Oh will optimize you know we'll pick a certain amount oh I res yeah high-res versions and then everything else will be stored on the cloud and I'm like well that's fine and dandy except for the fact that you're just gonna take you know if I have 20

Gigs or like 10 gigs free on my phone you're going to take all 10 gigs and I won't be able to do anything and I'm like I don't want you to you know you think about those old the old settings in apps where it's like Phil Phil remainder like on the ipod shuffle Phil remaining space with random songs you know I was basically picturing optimized storage like that it turns out that the science behind the secret special sauce going on in optimized photos is actually much cooler than that and it involves taking a percentage is looking at your available hard drive space and then

Taking a percentage of that and applying it to your stored photos and that percentage to can dynamically change so you know if you have you start off having like a hundred gigs free well the photos library might take like 20 or 30 gigs but if you drop down to like 0 10 or 15 gigs free say you just put a bunch of movies on your computer or whatever that automatically adjusts to make sure that you still have a certain percentage of free space and I think that's that's really cool and I'm hoping that that actually that legitimately might be a way for people to trust that

Apple can just manage the locally stored versus not locally stored and they don't have to worry like i usually do about okay i'm going to delete this file this file this found this file and I know it's stored low or up in the clouds I don't have to worry about having it on my hard drive it takes all of that in a nitty gritty management out of the users hands and has it all done autonomously which i think is really cool yeah it reminds me I'm gonna sound like old guy now for a few minutes but it reminds me of when this was a big problem in data software tuefel well because you're

Online how was Ram was really expensive and keeping information online was really expensive but offline was these tape backups that were incredibly hard to get anything off of and you didn't have anything in between and they ended up creating near line storage which would keep the the most highly used frequently used data online and keep the rest of it offline and then sort of intelligently manage and move things back and forth almost like how a fusion drive works how I cloud iTunes Match works it's just basically blurring the line between what's on your device and

What's on the cloud so if you favorite a picture or you open it a bunch of times or you just recently took it it's likely to be on your device in full fidelity and if you haven't if you took a bunch of photos a year ago and haven't looked at them since those are likely to be there in thumbnails with a very quick access to iCloud if you ever go back and want to tap on them again so it means that you have most of your stuff there too again like eighty percent of your stuff there if you ever need it in case of an Internet failure but everything else is just one click one tap and one

Download away and I think like you'll see the little I cloud icon on on stuff that isn't local and that's super smart because i want the speed of high availability but i don't want to give up all my storage and this sort of gives me the best of the world yet balances it all and I also appreciate that there's been again some smart thinking going into what should be stored including like your favorites photos as well as photos you've recently edited or photos that you're recently working with and there's also an option in photos right now if you right-click

On an album or an individual photos that says download and keep originals so if it's you like if you're going on a trip where you know you're not going to have internet access you can request that Apple download those you know that you download that that certain album or those certain set of photos so that you have them for sure when you're offline and some people worry also like for example I used to use iPhoto for my own iPhone photographs and an aperture for my DSLR photographs but apples built quite a lot of DSLR support into photos as well like you could of course you can

Import them in but it'll preserve raw it'll keep raw in iCloud photo library it'll it'll let you you may again you may not have lightroom like or aperture like brushes and all the width of the bells and whistles but as from a workflow perspective you can manage your DSLR photos as well as your iphone photos right inside photos yeah no it's um it's really cool um and yeah it's not some some sort of prosumer consumer apps just make dealing with raw photos a complete pain and the Photos app even in beta it's very smooth it's very fast it's very easy to you know tweak your

Your bounces and everything else with raw which is cool and raw will store in the clouds you don't have to worry about only uploading jpeg versions or anything like that yeah and so the only downside to that is when you create an Apple ID you get five gigabytes of iCloud storage for free after that you've got to pay for it i think it's like 99 cents to 99 99 999 for 500 gigs and ninety 2924 a terabyte yeah i paid the 999 for 500 gigs because i find it useful but it's not it's not in line with what other providers give you for free or what they charge but i feel that google drive or

You look at amazon you actually don't know but i was look at google drive if you look at microsoft one drive you look at Dropbox they're providing larger amounts of free storage and they're providing cheaper storage options and I kind of feel once I'm doing all this kind of stuff I don't know how Apple crunches the numbers on this thing but I've got to feel like they could maybe crunch the numbers on this and make storage less painful they have millions of dollars billions yeah I mean that's the that's the one sort of frustration is I'm already paying 10

Bucks a month for my terabyte of storage at Dropbox and you know I I are the Photos app allows you to or at least it appears to allow you to reference photos rather than upload them directly to that library file so you don't have to necessarily store everything in iCloud photo library you could do theoretically a drop box type solution my conflict there is kind of like well that's nice and all except for the fact that you know then I get no I don't get any interface with my with my iPhone I don't get the ability for the iphone photos to you know seamlessly sink and I don't get

The organism being able to organize on both of my devices i'd have to use like dropbox carousel on on phone and that's not you know carousels not the worst way in the world to organize your photos but at the same time it's not again we're splitting or splitting Styles here and it's like if you want to organize your photos you kind of want them to be a certain way all across your devices so I'm really hoping that Apple can figure out a slightly better monetary solution because like I would I would love to just use iCloud photo library but I'm also going to keep Dropbox cuz it's one

Of my you know my backup storage solutions so being a way to like pay for both and not feel financially crunched because I'm like I'm giving thirty dollars to me backup storage is a month you know it's what it's tough yeah you know you know you can keep using my photo stream if you prefer because my photo stream doesn't caught doesn't charge quote-unquote against your iCloud storage but it's only a thousand photos or 30 days you know it's got limits and it's not the sort of everything in one place ubiquitous photo solution that iCloud photo library charges and if you

Hate the internet or you just don't trust servers you don't have to use any cloud system at all with this it works as a standalone app but again you lose out on having all your photos everywhere anytime you want and that's such an enticing proposition that yeah I also hope they get that you know sort of doesn't fixed up yeah so I'm going through the things can i delete stored yeah so um if you put all your stuff in here are you doomed ren are you like is it a one-way street are you stuck in there forever no it's not um there's a

Very pretty easy way to export everything um both you know you can export your entire library or you can export individually you know individual albums or even individual photos they've made it very very simple for for you to be able to do that and for you to be able to get your your photos out of a specific program which I appreciate because you know the on its face the nebulous photos library data it makes a lot of people nerve nervous it's like it's one file what happens if it accidentally gets trashed sure you know so if you wanna if you want to test

Photos for mac and then you know decide six months down the line oh this really isn't for me a rather work in Lightroom yeah you can export all of your photos and at their full resolutions um or you can um you can just you know keep your old library and work concurrently um you can even off there's a there's a way a reference at a reference library so instead of storing everything within the photos library you can store it on your finder or stored on an external drive and just have links to those areas so um you know it's not not too terrible no not at all it's actually it's actually

Really cool the only caveat that we should remind people is you can do the import into photos and then still go back and use iPhoto or aperture and the same stuff will be in there but any changes you make from that point will be different so if you do edit so you do management in the Photos app that will not be reflected back into I photos or aperture or if you do you edits or changes in iPhoto or aperture that won't go back over to photos there's no sync between those no sadly no um but you know I get there still a fair amount of flexibility considering

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One of the developers happens to be super smart living in Montreal you know it's entirely coincidence definitely entirely coincidental no PDF n is really cool and you know I hate hate hate hate hate signing paper like I have to renew my passport pretty soon and I'm loving it because it requires me to like I don't know put on a coat and go out into the frigid north I don't know if you heard but the Northeast is covered under like four feet of snow um and I got like sign something with paper and mail it waits four to six weeks PDF pen like being able to do everything

Electronically is awesome and I you know sadly US government doesn't accept electronic passport renewals just yet but maybe in the future and if they do then i can use PF penta to sign for him so lame Kevin Mitchell akar you know my beloved supervisor warden I don't know gonna call him he had you needed me to sign a couple things and he's like just put them out sign I'm facts and I said no I say thee nay Kevin Mitchell and I'm using PDF pen / oh and I just you know opened up the file I added my digital signature to it i went and typed in some things wrapped it all up and send it off

To him and then three seconds later he was downloading PDF pen / 0 because he'd been faxing things around like an animal exactly it's we're not in the early 90s anymore that's to the fax machine we're not going to take it any yeah it's got updated modern Yosemite user interface it's got you can prove OCR text from scanned pages this context sensitive pop-up menus you can load and save performance improvements sorry there load and save its compatibility with iCloud Drive this free form there's just a plethora of new and awesome features and if you do anything that involves

Handling PDFs on your Mac you're really going to want this because wait for it it's going to make your life better it's just make life so much better mm-hmm so also extra information David Sparkes who zach max barks is in a series of new videos outlining how to do a bunch of common stuff so if you like the idea but you just not sure how to get started all you got to do is go to smile software com / PDF pen pro / screencast and you can just watch the videos Davis marks will walk you through it if you go to smile software com / I'm or you can get a ton more information and let's see

Them know that you find out about the app from this show but they're really the important thing is just to go and download the app so go to smile software com download it try it out enjoy it and let us know how you like it because I got a feeling you're gonna love it as much as we do great thank you smile software you are awesome whoo smile hmm all right so um yeah couple other things that we wanted to talk about yeah in terms of you want talk about photos like in terms of your final sort of thoughts about where it's going do you want to talk about all the other crazy great

Stuff we published this week yeah so maybe some final thoughts I'm really really excited about photos it is one of those cases where it's better than I thought it was going to be based just some WC because as much as I love I movie and Final Cut Pro 10 now it was hard initially you know I work was hard initially I feel like me I'm iMovie 11 Oh God it was hard and yet yes the stuff came back and I you our friend Martin Martin rice safe solvent he taught me how to do a three camera edit in two or five minutes on Final Cut Pro and I was producing a podcast it was amazing and I

Could never have done that on the old version and it so as much as I love them now it was hard at the beginning photos feels like it's much further along that curve like yes they rebuilt it from the ground up but they've put enough back that it doesn't feel anywhere nearly as painful as those other transitions did yeah I have to agree and it makes me think that they could have released a very bare-bones version of photos with 10 10 and we all would have complained and thrown a racket being like this isn't photos how dare you oh there yeah exactly but um you know that it

Looks like the software is worth the wait and hopefully they will continue to iterate upon it I think as it is right now I can solidly say that I will use this for organization you know I was waiting very sort of with bated breath because I honestly didn't know whether I was going to have to like buy lightroom and shift everything over the Lightroom or you know if that if that was going to be in my future but I feel confident in saying that like I can organize my photos in in the Photos app and hopefully with iCloud photo library and the storage space I want to worry about

I don't have the ten-dollar a month's 500 gigabytes just yet but i think i might need to upgrade yeah I I feel much demarco very nicely link to your faq and said that he was he was excited about it because it sort of felt it fit the niche of how he wanted to do his photography because his wife is a photographer but he's not he's taking much more casual family oriented photos and you know I photo wasn't quite enough an aperture was too much that's exactly how I felt and this might be that perfect niche like that as much as apple says the iphone is for every day photography I

Kind of feel like photos has become the app for everyday photographers hmm yeah and this might be the you know the Goldilocks bed the just right right in the middle perfect for me so comfy yeah so I'm you know I I think keep an open mind if you don't have the features right now that are that are essential for your workflow there are other programs don't panic you don't don't feel the need that you have to use photos just because it's an apple products like if it's if it doesn't think your work fool that's okay maybe it'll fit your workflow down the line

Maybe it won't but um you know whatever it has to be the it has to be the app that's right for you and even if you are a pro photographer chances are your people in your family who aren't and you probably don't want them messing with your super duper you know pro photography set up so you can just give them photos and i'll be happy exactly here take this make this work our tech support will go your burden will just plumb it exactly no tech support is good so yeah overall I've photos for Mac I don't keep on calling it I photo because the same way I'm gonna keep on calling

It I wash when I mean Apple watch because words but photos for mac beta beta given an early thumbs up and if you have questions if you want to know if something exists if it's missing if it might be coming in the future hit us up I'm more calm check out our FAQ cuz I basically am in that almost every day and answering people's questions and updating answers so if you still looking for information on that don't feel for I don't feel scared to hit us up she is making all the frequently asked questions frequently answered mm-hmm that's the goal so a couple new and

Exciting things run we've got two new columns that started this week so how are always hmm yeah I am really psyched about this too so today um are we putting out this show today I hope before the office yes friday um for for everybody will sing appliance Friday februari six we started a new author spotlight column or Renee's calling for backpage column I'm calling it the network we need to figure out it yes not going the naco was teasing me because he said that you have to flip the inert over and see the vodka ad before it becomes a real bad day yes the official

We will just have like a little rotation will what hey Derek Kessler kotas epsom make us something pretty I feel like friday is the back page of Oh mark as we start you know and then Friday is the end of the week Friday is like the fun day I'm gonna publish hopefully an article later on like goofy internet trolling tricks for imessage like it's the day where we're like all right you guys have had a crazy week let's let's have some fun with technology my day yeah exactly let's let's let's make it a good time um so and and jason has really sort of blasted this column off and our

Buddy Jason Snelling my former boss who writes at six colors calm now as well as has a couple of great podcasts including clockwise which I've been on Renee's been on in the past he is one of my absolute favorite people in the community he is wonderful he's sent eternally positive he wrote a fantastic piece for us on Apple's constant need to change and not being afraid to canalize its business and then also on his own experiences walking away from you know walking away from macworld after 17 years and how he's kind of forging out on his own and using Apple's and example

To jump forward and hit you the piece is fantastic if you haven't read it yet I highly suggest that you go over to I'm wearing and give it a looksie cuz I think he was the absolute perfect person to start off a column and we got so many more awesome people lined up we got Maddy Myers who's a gaming columnist she writes all over the place and she does she does original songs based on Metroid which i think is awesome she is like a band camp album which is fantastic his same as clone on Twitter we got Jesse char who's gonna write something hard fast we got wet who

Else we can't spoil too many people but uh no yeah let's leave it that for now yeah we have a couple other yeah but let's yeah it's um we got some good people but I just you know teasing mmm some people you've read before some people you've always wanted to read this is true so I'm so if you're you know if you like hearing opinions from people who are not me Renee Peter or Ali stick around on Fridays and stick wit ya so one of the reasons for that that was just that we we love all these voices we think they're what makes the Apple community so great and we really wanted

To give them a home you know everyone has their own size everyone has their own communities but we thought it would be nice if we could just make some little space on I more where people could come and share you know directly with us yeah I think it's a really nice way to hate that word curate but like to collect voices from all across our community young old you know multicultural female male just like people everyone has their own story and everyone's come at this community a little bit differently and I think it's really awesome to be able to share with

You I more people who you may not have read before and people who you know come out this community a completely different way than maybe Renee or I come at it and who might have different views and different opinions we want to expand your viewpoints read cool people have a lot of funds you know I think we're incredibly incredibly lucky you know thanks to all our readers to have a stage when you have a stage you want to fill it with great people exactly exactly and so yeah so leading to the other phone another new poem that we released of course we've had rich

Stevens doing comics but now we also have a section for art what we're calling the ex um you want to get talk a little bit about our experts column Renee sure so one of the things that we encountered is again you know just like there there aren't we can't cover every opinion we want to get really good people to have other opinions we don't know everything you know we know some things and we're happy to write about those but either we have to try and fake our way through other stuff which you know is really a parent or we just don't cover it which

Is really sad so we want to get people who have expertise in particular areas and who use Apple technology use macs and iphones and ipads and the internet to do amazing things and get them to sort of share with us what they do because first of all it helps bring attention to that kind of stuff but it helps give give us ideas ways that we can use this technology to improve our lives as well and immediately drafted georgia forced her to write the first my course well i mean a lot of people know her from i'm going over from you know laughing on um and I Sebastian isometric

Yeah or you know being on the I'm or show and talking about phones and things but she has a day job she is a licensed therapist and she helps people every day she does some of the most remarkable work I've ever seen and we did a show called Zen and tech for a while where she would share that but we've sort of discontinued that we're looking at making a new version of it but in the meantime I thought it'd be great if he could share some of what she does with technology and she wrote about procrastination and how she uses the iphone not as a distraction not to sit

There and play video games and you know not do her work but actually help her get her work done I thought that was a really cool angle yeah it was a great column and and there seemed to be a bunch of people and I'm worker really dug it so I'm we're gonna have again like you know it's not it's a disservice if Renee and I you know we can we can read up on something and we can write it to the best of our ability and God knows I love diving deep into something interesting like you know like coding but my you know my coding 101 is not going to be nearly as interesting as say

A coding one on one piece from a top iOS developer or like I'm top Mac Developer like sometimes you just you need the people who know the stuff inside and out in their blood to give you fresh perspectives and good ways to sort of understand and graph the information so we're really really happy to be able to again share people who you might not otherwise read or have read or get to get a chance to listen to tell you about how they use technology and again we have a lot of people coming up steve aquino who does fantastic writing about accessibility is doing next week's

Column and we have more people not too many spoilers because we never know exactly when certain columns are going to drop but we have a bunch of people lined up behind that and I think it just it helps make I'm or a better place and I think that's wonderful yeah yeah I really do think again growing our community is one of the things that we're really passionate about here and I'm or it's like we want to we want to build a community of Awesome awesome technology folks who really enjoy their technology and enjoy listening to other people talk about what they do with

Their technology so the more that we can do that better so now we have so we've got some awesome sort of programmed TD TV content yes appointment television um we must see TV so you've got rich Stevens with the pixel project which is our new web comic on Tuesday we've got our experts column on Wednesday we've got our you know the networker backpage column on Friday and we've got a rich Stevens rerun rich has been running some of his older Mac themed technology themed pixel comics on Saturdays so if you wake up Saturday morning you're like God I have nothing to read let me check

It anymore uh you wanna you know a little chuckle your day before you start out check out check out his rerun column yeah and it's sort of its colleagues and what I like so much is coexisting with the kind of stuff that we're formalizing like we're doing a roundtable on Thursdays this week's was about the Apple stores surrender knees doing the photography column on Tuesdays Ali's doing her do it yourself column on on Saturdays Peter and Ally you're doing Mac and iOS help columns I think those are on Tuesdays and Thursdays and it really is like it's it's in some ways a

Little more formal but in other ways it's also I feel a little more reliable ya know it's it's nice so that you know we really want to make consistent column so that you guys can you know feel like you have a place to go and check and you know consistently all right I've got an iOS question or maybe I mean I didn't know about this Mac question but hey Peter's writing about it so might be something interesting to read about ya know it makes me credibly happy and we have some other cool stuff coming your way as well like this is this is not this is the beginning this is not

The yes exactly we have two super-secret podcasts that I think we're gonna launch next week so keep your eyes peeled ears tuned buffer for those we already got the artwork in I'm so excited I'm so yeah then we got brand new album art on this episode of this show we do it's very fancy thanks to our designers for that in and Renee for tweaking and messing around it's for Jose Jose Negron and oh hey Thank You Jose so there's a couple other things that came out we mentioned the round table about Apple stores I really like that because part of the reason is we get a lot of

Feedback from these and in the beginning of energy and I were like oh those blue shirts and khakis that sounds awfully best buy and almost immediately like no no guys no it's not the khakis are optional it's just like the certain things that are more formal you know some stores were always that way other stores so I like these because again it's part of this community discussion that goes on yeah I also like going back and forth with you and Ali and Peter about various things like we did our Apple pay roundup and our iPad roundup and its really interesting to me because

I definitely have like my way of using my iOS devices and hearing what other people like and dislike about there's whether or not they're using Apple play like Peter and I got into a thing about you know just you know I use Apple pay all the time because the stores that I go to happen to support it but he's out in the cape and not so many stores supported and he's not going shopping that much anyway so being able to have you know that back and forth and be like oh you use your device completely differently than me that's that's really interesting Peter took the grumpy part

Of that argument I am shocked shocked I know Peter being grumpy get off my lawn yeah so there's just it was a ton of it I did I did a brief editorial on on full screen shots from the watch companion app started leaking out in icons and things and we always get asked why we don't you know really cover that stuff and the thing for me is I agree that NDA's for beta software like I'm running photos right now because I agree to the NDA for the beta version of OS 10 point 10 point 3 and that means I agree not like to follow apples rules and got much easier with this used to not be

Anything yeah I forget the term you use right he was really good was like an Iron Curtain yeah yeah the Iron Curtain um you know you think very much like the Apple berlin wall of secrecy but in the last seen on the last year to that that wall has slowly started to crumble and a lot more light has been getting through and it's like I really appreciate that Apple's being so forthright with a press and with people about like yeah we can talk about once we've released certain things we're happy if you want to talk about those and illuminate those and make sure that people actually

Understand what's happening but when we go to when we're talking about like murmuring and leaked stuff that's a little bit harder to report on because again it's like it's like how what you were comparing two in the article Renee where it's you know when I was a kid I would read spoiler sites incessantly because you know those days it was pre DVR um but like the internet had just become a thing so I was missing my regular shows all the times and I use the spoiler sites to kind of like keep me apprised to be like all right that's what hat that's what's gonna happen okay

I feel good even if i don't like if I don't get to see that that episode I still know what's going on with like the Apple watch I'm like some of these things you know it's it's more fun to open presents on Christmas morning sometimes you don't you don't need to see every little nitti baby piece because then you know again if you if you peek at a Christmas present you're like oh man it's a transformer and then you open it up and it's actually socks you're like uh when did that happen well that's exactly true i mean and it happened a really good example of this

Was the health app last year it leaked out before the beta came out and it was using a card metaphor but at some point Apple realize we have way too much data for a card metaphor we're going to put it in a listview and then it came in with a list view and was like well what happened to the card metaphor I kind of like that better and it's sort of like when you when you like right now do I want to know what's happening in the next star wars movie do I want to know what happens with arrow and race al Ghul maybe but if they change those plans i'm going to be thinking on you know i

Thought that was better why didn't they do and it just changes it changes my reaction from being about the the final product to being about the process I love process but I like to look at the process now after the product it's same way like if you read a book or a movie and it's really an individual thing some people movie spoilers some people love device and software leaks I personally don't do it because when I agree to an NDA if I don't follow apples n da I don't feel like any developer could trust me to follow their NDA and then I won't get to

See and write about all this cool software and do previews for everybody when it launches and help articles and stuff and I think for me it's worth it you know other people think I don't care about NDA's I'm never gonna assign one you know I don't want that responsibility if I find something that's free and clear to publish that's great too i mean there's all sorts of sites you can go to and you know different things you can look at yeah the way I feel about that kind of like you know it's not we are not investigative journalists here we're

Tech journalists like there's there's there's a certain compulsion and a certain requirement for investigative journalists to publish things that the audit you know that their audience that that people have a right to know about in tech journalism that that window of things of like things that people should know is much smaller like you know sexism in tech absolutely something that you should break an NDA or whatever to write about um what the Apple watches you know icon might look like and then I i don't i don't feel personally a driving need to be like yes this is

Something that people should know about if the people don't know about what this icon looks like at this exact moment i'm not doing my job as a journalist damn it mmm yea though i was gonna make a princess bride quote right there what pursue them practice these days right yeah I know yeah yeah absolutely exactly i'm not gonna be able to look at Michael Fassbender and steve jobs now and not think of Christian Bale it's just I'm I'm sorry I read it for myself no I know is this spoilers spoilers spoilers yeah but you can choose for yourself it's just that's why we don't cover that

Stuff and I want to I want to give a shout out before we close Renee jerk to a wonderful tech website that is no longer publishing closed its doors this week to our on official web advil web blog um I wrote a little bit about 20 and about my experiences with IDG and just about you know how how Apple's you know how big companies can either respect or not respect their smaller divisions and have them work for them and to out did some great work over the years and I was really really personally sad to see them go they will a great writers um in a lot of great

People if you have you know if you're looking for a great writer look at the old and look at the two out by lines hire somebody but you know they did some great work over the last you know 10 10 years I think they started up in 2004 and it's just it makes me sad and I'm like I'm I'm really bummed for them i'm excited to hear you know there's there's some new apple websites coming out including apple world today which is going to be to our veterans but also like when i wrote that piece i wanted to like you know tip my hat to chew out and also point out that like the people who

Are like oh and you know first macworld then to well you know niche blogs hobby blogs are going down in flames yeah exactly and I'm like Ian not so much guys it's not you know like not no no no talking corporate secrets but more we're doing pretty good we have a great audience we love you guys we're having a great time doing this stuff and we focus on the essentials but you know what what makes us you know what what I'm really happy about like working here is that we have a parent corporation and we have bosses that understand what we do versus what our other publications do and where

We fit into the general scheme of things and some people that you know that's very true of and other companies it's less true and so the whole niche blog is dead meme I want to kill that wanna kill Kyle of time I love the EA uh I don't know I would but the way that you phrased it because you look at something like the Apple TV and for Apple that's no business and you know a lot of companies would just cancel that and yes there is a compelling future to it but they might cancel and relaunch it but apple doesn't do profit and loss per per division or product they do that for the

Entire company and for that very reason is because they never want to have pressure put on an individual component that by itself does not create an enormous value but when combined as part of their overall offering really enhances the value of their other products the apple TV makes the iphone and the ipad better and that's valuable to them and i think that you know we have you know i'm always doing great but we have you know connected lee which we're just building up and who knows what's going to happen to that but for now it's just a really interesting space

And we believe it adds value to all the other sites that we run and it's always going to be a decision as always to be you know challenging to make these things work but I like the idea of a world where there is room to nurture smaller smaller things or more nice things as part of your overall ginormous Empire of thing yeah well it it's funny his you know the late pat McGovern who is CEO of IDG for very long time which is a parent company of mackerels um he start you know he started a DG is a huge analyst business IDC as well as doing journalism and there's a quote going

Around I can't I don't remember the exact quote but he was very much like you know our journalism business you know our analysts business may make ninety percent of the profit but you know we have the journalism so that people can understand our numbers so that you know that that the people actually understand what's going around on in the world of technology and they can feel informed so we're not just you know publishing things into a void where it's like oh yes we the we we want to show exactly what kind of rules that we could build for four people um and I I

Feel like that that's kind of apples motif as well as the you know you got it you've got to be willing to take some take a risk on smaller things and trust that they're going to work out for you and that's not you know that's not always going to be the truth I mean we can look at the Apple cube poor poor little g3 cute but um g4 cube but um but it's worth taking the risk and it's worth you know supporting this and you know if you can't make it work in a big company then there's nothing to say that it's you know it might be time to go off on your own um you look at you know what

Again my former boss Jason is doing with six colors or what gender amba was doing with hoop in sight yeah um there's there are a lot of or John doing daring fireball for that matter there's there are a lot of a lot of different ways that we can provide value to the Apple community and the gaming community and the car blog community the scientific community like there are tons of niche blogs it just Ben Thompson another great one yes to exert a curry is amazing um it's just you know finding your own finding your way of fitting into the community

And if you're working with a bigger parent company making sure that they understand those those file those values you know building a building a small audience is important and curate you know building a loyal audience is the most important thing of all so I'm raising a glass to our friends at chaos cheers it's your way to junior Mike tiros Dave chalo I'm gonna forget so many to access area yeah dawg grog yeah so so many people worry people yeah and people christina warren i first met when she was working it to a nick fletcher at so many scott McNulty work there just so

Many luminaries all of them cheers guys yeah thank you n so if people want to find you around about internet way where do they go they can find me at se tter n on the twitter as well as the Instagram and on I'm more calm where I will no doubt be writing so much about photos in the coming months so so much about photos all the whole of things um you can find Peter Cohen at Florrick lar gh you can find a leak as muha at I muggle IMU ggle and you can find me at Rene Ritchie re and ER I TCH ie I want to thank everyone who joined us live everyone who listens to the show we're

Going to be moving the show to wednesdays starting next week i might not be on it oh we're gonna be moving it to when they get out yeah we'll figure it out starting next week because we have some other stuff that's going to be debuting soon and want to make sure that everything cast secret podcast that we want to make sure everything is properly you know spread out for you guys but you know if you missed the show live you can find it on itunes and if you you can if you wanna watch the video version you can go to slash I more video if you haven't yet please leave a rating

Please leave a review it helps itunes know that you're actually interested in the show and then you know they they feature us a little bit and that never hurts never thank you well you're a wonderful handsome insightful community and you're just awesome yeah and thank you to for sponsoring us and smile software we appreciate it it helps us you know keep the lights on oh yeah I know just what one more time you can you know we have a great offer from Linda calm you can sign up for a free 10 day trial you go to /i more we're challenging you Linda's

Challenging you I'm challenging you infinity is challenging you to do something great in 2015 you can learn about iOS 8 iphone and ipad essential training setting up your mobile office speeding up and maintaining your Mac anything you want to know whether it's a little bit or a lot you can get it from Linda calm so once more naw Kham /i more free 10-day trial just do it do it it's fun Linda's great thanks everybody have a great weekend take care

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