Armenia & Azerbaijan Conflict Explained

by birtanpublished on August 25, 2020

My guest today is aram hamparian who is the executive director of armenian national committee of america and today we're going to talk about the recent challenges and conflict you've been seeing between armenians and azerbaijan

A lot of you guys have been asking me about what's really going on the armenian community has been asking pat can we actually talk about it so i decided to bring aram on today and he was kind enough to uh

Make the time to be a guest with us here even though he's in dc right now trying to uh solve a lot of big problems so arum thank you so much for making it time for me to get somebody attainment

Thank you so much patrick glad to be here so arum just to put things into optics here uh uh the data between armenian azerbaijan when i look at the numbers myself here's

What i see azerbaijan's gdp is around 40 billion dollars a year armenia's gdp is 11 billion dollars per year azerbaijan spends around one and a half billion dollars into their military

Every year armenia spends 430 million azerbaijan has around 10 million people armenia's got three million which is between them is 150 000 of which 20 000 is military active azerbaijan has 57 000 active soldiers

Armenians have 42 000 azerbaijan has 300 000 reservists armenia has 210 000 before for some of us that maybe haven't followed every single detail of what's going on between

Armenian azerbaijan you got azerbaijan that's around three times the size of armenia tell us the history of the conflict what's causing a resurgence again what's going on why are there

People on the streets of l.a carrying armenian flags or azerbaijani flags a flat out brawl taking place that's all over the news what's really going on okay uh it's a great question patrick and it has a

History to it so this all has its roots uh back in the soviet union uh joe stalin did a lot of rotten things a lot of really evil things one of those was to carve out a big

Chunk of armenia and hand it over to azerbaijan as part of like the soviet dividing conquer politics in that part of the world and by that part of the world i mean it's south of russia

It's north of iran it's it's east of turkey so as they say a tough neighborhood so this piece of army was carved out arbitrarily illegally uh by the soviets and when the soviet

Union collapsed the armenians stepped up and said hey this is the time to fix uh the wrongs of the past to write the uh the injustices of the soviet era and when they did that azerbaijan they didn't like it they started a war

Uh they fought it for about five years they lost the war it's been about 25 years since we've had a ceasefire in place but osborne john's not happy about it so every once in a while

They cross the line of contact they attack the armenians and that's what happened just a couple weeks ago and and so so while this is happening what is constantly creating an

Igniting tension again like was there an event because when you read on both sides you see azerbaijanis campaigning tremendously spending a lot of money to make it seem like it is armenians

Making the attack and at the same time you know i'm armenian you know i have armenians in my office and i in my organization have folks from both countries you're hearing stories from the other

Side on what's going on i'm trying to find out what is igniting it is somebody poking each other to kind of get them to keep competing having conflict what's really the backstory of what's going on today sure

The question of who is initiating aggression is a great question but a difficult question to answer because there aren't a lot of observers on the ground we have through congress push for

Initiatives that would deploy gunfire locators along the line of contact those gun fire locators would be monitored by the international community and they could ascertain where the gunfire is coming

From where it's directed toward the type of munitions involved a very neutral way to call balls and strikes to umpire the situation the armenian side has embraced that the

Azerbaijani side has rejected it we take their rejection as their way of saying they don't want to be held accountable because they're the side initiating the attacks uh add to that

That the president of azerbaijan ilha malia you know regularly boasts about his his aggression against armenia and he even talks about how he's going to reclaim

Um all of our union including the capital which uh he considers an author by johnny city makes sense so philosophically if you can help us obviously i know but imagine assume the audience

Doesn't know what do the armenians believe in that's different than what the azerbaijani believes in and what is the religious differences political differences philosophical differences

What is the biggest differences between the two regions okay uh the dispute over karabakh or artsof as it's called by many armenians uh is over who should run the territory our view

Is that it's historically armenian territory with churches for example going back uh to the earliest uh days of christianity including there's a dottivong which is a monastery which was

Actually founded in the first century by a student of the apostle thaddeus so we we know the history's on our side the azerbaijan would say no but the law is on our side because

The soviets stole it for us fair and square and they argue that well you know the soviet union uh gave this to us therefore we should get to keep it we don't think that uh that receipt of

Stolen property gives people title to anything uh so that's the the dispute on the territory in terms of demographics we have uh two countries of different faiths

The armenians are armenian apostolic called apostolic because of the apostles studies and bartholomy preached christianity and armenia in the first century uh the azerbaijanis are majority muslim majority shia they

Are ethnically closer to turks um uh but religiously closer to iran iran being shia azerbaijan and of course turkey being sunni so there's that religious divide but there's also a political and

Democracy divide uh armenia's had great elections really worked hard against corruption very transparent system uh in azerbaijan you have the current president who was given his job

By his father who before him was a kgb general and then when the son got the job ilham the current president he made his wife the vice president uh by all accounts he's grooming his son to

Be the next president it's very possible that an olive will run they have run the country for almost all the last 50 years and it's very possible that they will run the country for the

Next 50 years it's one thing he made his wife the vice president yes and maybe his the interesting thing is that this talk about how he's you know brought his wife and his vice president and there's

Others who believe that his wife lets him serve as president makes sense that that's interesting so that that's kind of like i mean to put it in optics of what's going on in the u.s

That's kind of like saying you know michelle obama's the vp and uh president barack obama's the president or trump and his wife that's that's a pretty interesting place to be between the two

Of them so then the question would be who is allies of who meaning you know the enemy of an enemy as a friend who who is the ally of azerbaijan who are allies with

Armenia who's trying to defend armenia who's trying to defend us thereby john patrick you mentioned the numbers earlier and the numbers are daunting it's definitely a david versus goliath situation

When you think about the military the economic uh the demographics all of that but to really get the full picture you you add turkey to the uh azerbaijan equation and the turks

And ozil's often say you know uh one nation two states that they feel very very close kinship and if you add to azerbaijan's numbers the 85 million people in turkey the second largest army in nato

A 16th largest economy in the world you have two extremely powerful enemies to the east and west both blockading armenia armenia a partition state a genocide survivor

State landlocked no access to the sea a traditional trading nation that can't trade because there's only one airport that reaches the rest of the world so you

Have a small christian outpost on the frontier of freedom on the frontier of faith with these two huge powerful enemies on either side sometimes the georgian border gets close sometimes

It's open but it's generally decent relations up north sometimes the border to the south is open uh sometimes it's not so armenia is really in a precarious

Situation um and finds itself on needing to reach out to the americans to the europeans to the middle east uh and and to russia as well so russia ends up becoming armenians end up

Turning to russia for help with security uh not because there's any special orientation toward russia but more because they live in an existential fear of of um

The turks finishing what they started in 1915 and this is not like something that you know we just think we're making up out of thin air they remind us from time to time we will finish the work of 1915. and and

It's it's it's a scary proposition to be an armenian in that part of the world did president erdogan say that recently that we will finish the work the work that people started is is he

Recorded saying that yeah actually he gave a speech not with those exact words but he said look the work that we began uh a century ago in the caucuses we will complete um

A previous president turkey ozawa was much more explicit and and during the war in karabakh said uh war in the armenians we will teach you the lessons of 1915 which every armenian around the world

Understands every assyrian around the world understands that's like those are chilling chilling words when they're spoken by unrepentant um unrepentant perpetrators of generals you know

You know we we bought an rv a few years ago and we went and we lived in it for 30 days and we went from la to miami to canada to san francisco back to l.a i spoke in 16 17 different cities in front of

Thousands of people and we stopped by dallas once now obviously we're in dallas now but back then we were living in l.a we stopped by dallas and we went to this turkish cafe i went to this turkish cafe

And i'm i'm always wanting to talk to my waiters whoever i'm doing business but i'm going to talk to them and it's nice kid shows up and i said so how you doing it says good i said

Where are you from i'm from turkey so really you're from turkey says yes so you know what do you think about this whole armenian genocide thing you know i keep hearing about it what do you think now he has no clue i'm armenia so what

Do you think about this all armenian genocide thing he says oh let me tell you something these armenians all they want to talk about is that what we did to them it's they're telling a lie it never really

Happened you know our meeting in genesis all this other stuff i'm like who taught you that he says in school i said what did the school teach you about the history of the genocide he says the history i

Learned in turkey is the history that all of it is a lie they were doing it to us and so we wanted to defend our families etc etc i said have you ever done research and looked at it from a different person's

Angle from armenian angle he said no so he says where are you from i said i'm armenian so immediately the whole thing kind of changed right but you know to the world who is not

Emotionally attached to the armenian i'm armenian emma and i'm a syrian so i heard about the genocide from the assyrian side my father said and i heard about the genocide from the armenian side year and

Year and year after year and it's been accepted by some 60 plus countries you would know the number better than i would the exact number better than i would

And recently we had senate passed a resolution which was congr republican-led congress passed a resolution armenian-led then it came to the president trump

And there was a blockade it was never passed never took place and you you wonder why that took place but from your point of view i have some reasons why i think that took place but i'm curious

From your point of view why has it been that whether it's under a republican administration or whether it's under obama who multiple times he said he's going to do his part to you know make the armenian genocide

Official why do you think presidents both on the left and the right are so concerned about just saying what 60 other plus countries have said that this event took place back in 90 why why are they so hesitant about doing

That well the bottom line is that turkey is still as unfriendly as turkey is an important nation with in terms of uh intelligence capability in terms of uh economic

Commerce in terms of military bases so turkey has leverage and they exercise that leverage very aggressively and very intelligently and they have been able to bully sometimes bribe uh successive u.s administration so um

What happens in the end is just weakness on the part of of u.s presidents and they um that they get the worst case scenario is thrown at them some doomsday scenario that everything will fall apart and they just they back

Off of this and what happens is you end up with a policy that's not an american policy at all it's it's a turkish policy a policy uh built in turkey exported to the u.s and then

Enforced by u.s presidents which is which is really shameful because uh every other country that that's recognized the armenian genocide has been threatened by turkey

But once they take that step turkey backs off and the trade continues and the the cooperation on intelligence and trade and and military cooperation it continues so

We just needed an american president this president or the next president um to just call turkey's bluff and say um you know we're not going to let you bully us on this anymore we're not going

To uh let you impose a gag rule on what we say or don't say do you think president has access to some information that maybe we don't have that when they go in they're all very you know inspirational i'm gonna defend the

Armenian community and the assyrian and the greeks that this event happened and then they go in they're like oh okay here's the generals telling me that if i do do this this is what could happen to

The three military bases that we have in turkey and the consequences of this could be do you think they have access to some information that we don't have i mean what is it that makes it so scary for

These guys to just say this event took place uh let me say this the argument that there's something we can't tell you and that's the reason why we're doing this that was floated for many years

In congress including uh by very senior people in the intelligence intelligence committees uh as it turns out two of the top house members on intelligence adam ship and devin nunes don't always

Agree uh but they both have access to pretty much everything in terms of the us intelligence community and they're arden supporters of u.s recognition of the armenian genocide so there is

There is that card that is played that you know if only you knew uh you wouldn't do this but that hasn't seemed to work in congress i think it's i think in the end uh france and and and germany and other

Countries have similar concerns um and i think that it's that's just a card that is played to kind of keep us quiet so maybe maybe let's ask a different question so the question let's just say

Okay it does happen okay meaning today president trump comes out hey i've made a decision we are going to make this official this event did take place what is the worst thing that can happen

If we make that official uh i think turkey will withdraw its ambassador uh turkey will suspend whatever uh current military deal is on the table they will pout for maybe a month

Possibly two months and then the ambassador will come back in a very kind of low-key way the deals will get continued they'll start renegotiating everything and it'll be

A slight bump in the road but but nothing significant and that's borne out by every other country that's that's recognized the armenian genocide none every one every single one has had an

Increase in trade with three it's just kind of a bluff that needs to be called and president trump is well positioned to do it because he's not so automatically deferential to the dc establishment i agree you know

The the crowd in this town like the one thing one thing that obama said that made sense was he said change comes to washington it doesn't come from washington um so waiting for the d.c establishment

Uh to come around to finally doing the right thing you know our grandkids won't see it but but a political figure who doesn't it doesn't defer automatically to what he calls the swamp you know this

Ball position to do the right thing i i think he's the right guy to do it by the way i think if there's been a guy in the last 20 30 years i could do it i think it's him i don't think it's been anybody else that could do because

Every single one of them has been so deeply into the political world that the amount of favors they own with the swamp they've been a part of they can't do but he could do it because he's not connected to it but let me go

Step a little deeper okay let's just say it does become official does the argument for the armenian community to go back and ask for reparations similar to how

The jews were able to do from germany which just recently ended a few years ago reparations were just paid off by germany a few years ago that was an event that took place a long time ago is there that fear that

If america makes it official armenians are now going to have the next step to take to go and say here's what you did to us you or this community you know 1.2 trillion dollars are you or this

Community 220 billion dollars and this is how we should break it down et cetera et cetera is there that level of concern that erdogan has yes and he's right to have that concern

I can tell you speaking as a community leader that reparations are absolutely on the table that um you know sometimes the leaders of turkey will say something like how could there be consequences

Today a cost today to something that happened a century ago and the answer is a painful answer but it's that yeah they're hopping costs they've all been born on the shoulders

Of assyrians and chaldeans and syriacs and armenians and greeks we've worn those consequences for a century now and we believe the perpetrator should bear uh those consequences as well um another

Way to think about it is that a lot of movements and the gender are meaning genocide is a long movement of decades-long movement uh that recognition is very often the precursor

The necessary precondition for remedies and i'll give an example a few examples south africa movement started as a movement to for people to understand the evil of apartheid and when they did

They started doing the right thing about it the global warming people had to understand the nature of global warming and have recognition of the harms

Before they put in the remedy same with cigarette smoking you know for years people didn't even acknowledge that cigarettes were bad for you but once they did and once the government did and once even the tobacco

Companies kind of took ownership of the harms then you saw all the remedies in place so we're at that point the inflection point of the armenian genocide issue where

We're finishing up the recognition and that's important the white house is next and then we move to the remedies and we try to remedy the issue uh what the basic idea of justice here would be something like

What can be returned should be returned what cannot be returned should be compensated that's a very sort of basic concept of justice that i think most cultures have you make it sound like basic and simple i don't

Think it's going to be simple though i think it's pretty complex issue that we're talking about so let's unpack that so let's just say it's been done okay let's say he pulls the ambassador

Let's say he decides to pull the military out of a turkey you know whatever he puts threats let's say tariffs let's say issues let's say he attacks armenia a little you know he funds azerbaijan even more supports him

Let's say all of that stuff happens and then the dust settles and then you are to go back and ask for reparation what will be the amount and what will be the request will it be land will it be give us and it's done it's

Not azerbaijan will it be this is the amount of money has that been thought of because i would assume for for yourself to be the executive director of the armenian national committee of

America you've probably prepared your next 5 10 15 20 moves in case that does happen if that does happen has the committee already thought about what that amount and the request would

Be yeah we have and a lot of very good reports have been written on the subject including one called i think uh resolution with justice which is a sort of a blueprint that we

Look to it's available online if you want to want to find it it's uh i would say that we would start from the premise of um the victims should be made whole the victim should be made whole now

That's difficult because lives cannot be brought back and and certain churches are not going to be rebuilt but to the extent possible you try to make the victim whole in that sense

We would say as a nation right there are individual claims and those are important there are particular churches and institutions that have claims and those are important too

But i'll speak to just the national idea armenians existed on that part of the world alongside the syrians and many others for thousands of years maybe going back six or seven thousand years the elements

Of viability that that nourished our existence are our demographics our economic resources our agricultural resources our water resources our defensible borders all these things that

Sort of come together to make the the equation of armenian viability uh those were like destroyed they were rent uh during 1915 and we want to bring that back together so that armenia remains

A viable state among the family of nations woodrow wilson made this point uh in after the war which is that armenia's you know this may yet be a fatal wound to the armenians what can we do to make

Sure that and this is the europeans agreed with this as well sort of the american senate at the time uh what could we do to restore armenia to its place so that it can survive

And what at least the this arbitral award the wilson arbitral award said okay here's the territory needs and they drew a map of armenia that they thought was necessary and they said well they need a black sea coast because they need

To trade so they put the city of trevison in there and then they looked at the various agricultural resources where is there going to be enough grain where is there going to be enough

Livestock and they came up with a formula that would would allow armenia to survive i think that's the north star it's not a dollar amount or a particular amount of square miles it's

How can this this nation that suffer this terrible crime through no fault of its own have its place at the table of nations and i i as an armenian actually feel very strongly about the

Assyrian situation and worry that everything that's been visited upon the armenians has been visited upon the syrians and sometimes worse but without a state to protect them and that's that makes

Armenia's viability is strongly and very powerfully challenged uh but in the context of having a state which is something you have an economy and you have borders and you have an army but the the what the assyrians face

Primarily in iraq and in the broader regions is is even scarier and but nonetheless we have to fight for justice these it's so this is an important point uh it's not backward looking justice

Some kind of revenge or retribution oriented justice it's the justice that would allow us uh to remain that's not a lot to ask the the the syrian people the armenian people we deserve our place at the table

Of nations it was taken from us through violence and we want that place restored so when we talk about justice it's about tomorrow and the next day and the next year and the next hundred years

So that's that's that's our our hope i mean if you look at the number since 1952 the german government has paid over 80 billion dollars in pensions and social wealth welfare payments to jews who suffered under the nazi regime

And that's 52 we're not even considering inflation right this number to the turkish is it fair to say that could be five times that six times that easily yeah

But i i would just understand that the cost i'll speak about the cost to the armenians uh like in economics we talk about opportunity costs okay what was the opportunity cost of

The genocide uh uh scholars have studied where would the armenian nation be had there not been a genocide and the numbers they come up with are something like

20 million 25 million armenians in what would be the armenian highland what's sometimes called anatolia so if you can imagine for a moment uh the what is now the eastern part of turkey populated

By an uh 25 million armenians millions and millions of assyrians and other uh christians uh with their own state able to develop an economy for a hundred years and if you know armenians and assyrians

They would develop their economy in just no question robust ways and we would be a regional player we would be an economic power we would be a hub for the rest of the region god knows

Uh where we might have been so not when we talk about the cost like my lord what might have been what might have been and that was taken from us most of it can't be restored but it should be compensated it should

Be compensated and uh that that's i think that's the scope of what the damage that happened the turkish state uh patrick in many ways through they by the way they pushed out

An economic the armenians and syrians and greeks were very economically advanced in the ottoman empire so they removed that competition for themselves and then took a lot of the assets and a

Lot of what turkey is today was built upon the foundations established by by christians who by the way used to be 20 of uh up until 1915 20 of the population of the current turkish

Borders used to be christian now it's like point two percent it's it's a tiny tiny fraction uh and i guess i gotta go back to my point which is like what might have been and that that

The huge cost was paid by uh our peoples that's a very powerful point now again i'm gonna ask you this next question i i have an idea of the answer to this question but i think it's important for the audience to know

How have armenians and assyrians positively impacted the society how have uh what have armenians done in the history and i'm talking about i'm not talking right now i'm talking about in

The history books how have these two different societies specifically armenian because you are armenian how has that community positively impacted the world

In just about every sphere of activity we have uh kirkakorian who was a great uh um a businessman and uh philanthropist uh a lot of the work that armenians do around the the country and around the

World is funded by the korean um legacy uh we have people like ray damayan who invented the mri machine which has saved countless lives around the world we have uh the atm

Machine was invented by armenia and the single handle faucet was invented by alex manugan so we have a lot of folks one of the guys right now helping to develop a vaccine for kovid

Is nubra fan he's armenian so we're all over the place we have uh our celebrities like you know kim kardashian we've got uh businessmen like uh alex ohanian uh we have you thank god

And uh and so many others i think we've tried wherever we ended up you know wherever we parachuted down in the world you know we pretty much got our act together got ourselves a good education

And usually started a business of some sort and uh and yeah yeah i think if there's one thing i would say about assyrians and armenians it is that we are highly adoptable

And uh i think it was darwin who said that the it's not the strong it's not the smart it's the adaptable that's surviving that's yeah they're definitely adoptable and and again the reason why i'm asking

This question is because i'm trying to see um i'm trying to see how this needs to be presented for trump for trump to say okay let's do it right i mean that's the only way i'm looking at

This year because uh uh so it's three million people today in armenia 20 to 25 million that's a big number you know them creating commerce armenia right now is the little silicon valley

I've hired so many engineers from armenia and i know businesses that are not led by a middle eastern armenian they're they're talking about they trust armenian engineers

To develop their own software or technology more than they do some other engineers because armenia is developing something you would have never thought the little silicon valley would be in armenia and

Uh what what they're doing so i'm looking at it from the standpoint of okay trump you know you're looking at the turkish community erdogan would be responsible for having

To pay back say a few hundred billion dollars maybe shy of a trillion dollars so it's a big number that they're gonna have to pay but maybe they're gonna have 60 70 80 years to pay that off so it's not like they're gonna have to make one

Payment it's a payment that'll be made over the years so the hit is really going to be say 600 billion over 60 years it's a billion year or trillion dollars over six years it's a billion it's not really

A big number okay i can see that so again that one part then the other side why do you need to win the armenian community over okay well first let me do this i don't think i'm sorry let me give the second part

Why do you need to win the armenian community over in us so election re-election why do you need to win the armenian community then you're seeing the rise of a kim kardashian then you're seeing the kardashian family

Coming up then you're seeing the kind of influence they have the collective influence on instagram i i would sit there and i would think if somebody from the camp is watching and saying okay what if

We do you got nearly a half a billion followers on instagram just on that family and imagine if they posted saying the first president that did this the level of legacy that would be uh left for him and the level of loyalty

Potentially converting certain people to being believers and him because he had the audacity to do something that other administrations couldn't do i'm making the case to see what that case would be

For him to say okay let's do because he's a businessman if you present a good opportunity he may want to consider so how would you present it to trump for trump to say i think this makes sense sure i think

That president trump has spoken uh very eloquently about an america first policy one where policies are made in america for american interests this clearly is not an american policy all he would need to

Do is step aside and say look i'm going to let my state department my nasa security council just study the facts look at the moralities morality the situation and then call it straight

Without letting anyone have a veto of the situation armenians or turks right if if he does that like within 10 minutes they would come to the conclusion that they should speak honestly about the genocide so he just

Basically needs to take a neutral stance step away and stop carrying turkey's water uh in washington uh second it's not really america's responsibility to cover

Turkey's uh sins you know turkey has its sins and they should answer for them but that's not sure become an american liability in terms of the kardashians they're very very powerful position

Uh there were some amendments that went through the house uh last month uh patrick that were uh very important to us about armenia and and and also cutting some arm sales to azerbaijan and the kardashians

Weighed in on that it was it's the national defense authorization act stuff a little technical but they got right up on the facts and they they instagrammed and tweeted about

It and i think that helped us win those votes um in terms of armenians as a political influence i would say that our heaviest presence of course is in california

Uh where you have you know upwards of a million armenians uh but unfortunately california is not a swing state actually yeah but some states where i mean these are arsenal states like michigan

Uh pennsylvania ohio florida even wisconsin to an extent so uh i know that um that in like let's say the detroit suburbs were huge last election if the if the if the campaigns either side are looking at

You know who's gonna win the philly suburbs the detroit suburbs uh maybe some of the big cities in florida it wouldn't hurt to have you know 40 50 000 uh friends on your side

And that's i think the politics of it i think those are the states that everyone's paying attention to yeah that makes sense to where you're putting it on what what would win and what would and where the influence was i

Mean by the way detroit is also a bigger syrian community very big they have over there and you know when i'm looking at the military right now strongest military in the middle east if you look at the middle east top 10

I'll give number five is saudi arabia number four is iran number uh number three is israel number two is egypt number one is turkey most powerful and if you go in the world most strongest military in the

World they are number nine head of german head of italy ahead of egypt ahead of brazil ahead of iran ahead of pakistan ahead of a lot of people i mean they're just right behind

You know uh uk i mean turkey is right behind uk so i i i'm seeing you know every time i go into this you know uh rabbit hole i'm seeing what is the biggest hesitation why are they

So afraid of these guys over there but that's the benefit of having a strong military you know a lot of times the u.s gets condemned for the amount of money we invest into i'm a guy that was in the army so you

Know i'm pro-military i was at the 101st airborne i'm always going to be pro-military but sometimes you look at these types of situations where somebody sits there and has to decide

If we do this to tick them off you're essentially taking off the most powerful military in the middle east what could be the consequences of that and how does that hurt our relationship with the other nations

That are relying on oil to come out of the middle east could that potentially create another recession that's gonna so it's it's that whole connection and connecting the dots so you know i'll give the final thoughts to

Here before we wrap up so you know what do you foresee happening in the future with this and why why should someone who is not armenian be more interested in topic in this

Topic and be willing to share with other people and start wanting to go a little bit more deeper for themselves and say listen we need to do something with this community because i think we're going to need more than

Just the armenians who are going to want to shed light on what is taking place today so what would you say to that sure i'll give one answer to the east and one answer to the west please

Uh uh the west we have uh azerbaijan that's very aggressive uh toward armenia and the cost of that obviously is paid by young armenian men typically 18 or 19 years old but recently the defense minister in

Azerbaijan said that he or he threatened rather to launch a missile strike against the nuclear power station in armenia uh that's when i think the world starts

Paying attention because uh you don't attack a nuclear power station to hurt your enemy you hurt you do it to destroy the region maybe poison you know hundreds and hundreds of miles

A 100 mile radius or 200 mile radius maybe more maybe a radioactive cloud from that would damage the world so i think that's when the world starts paying attention when this threat on nuclear power

Station uh to the to the to the west is turkey and uh obviously we care about their denial of the genocide it makes armenia less safe when our neighbor is an unrepentant perpetrator of this terrible crime

But it's also um because the rest of the world is less secure when there's this terrible precedent of a genocide committed with impunity it sends a signal uh to the hitlers of the world and the

Paul pots of the world and and those who committed genocide in rwanda or darfur that this is a tool available to them that you can commit this crime and if you have enough geopolitical

Power the world will turn a blind eye and that you consolidate the the fruits of this crime really without consequence it's the lesson of the armenian genocide sadly sadly is that genocide works

So we want to end that precedent and and teach the world and teach the 15 or 25 year old who's studying this issue today that no that's that cannot be done because the world will with one voice

Condemn genocide do you think the ideal situation for the turkish empire is to eliminate anybody that's armenian and assyrian in the world is that the vision they have or is it just to get rid of armenia

Um i think that the the existence of armenia between two parts of the turkic world is inconvenient for uh turkey and that there's been a pan-turkish or pan-turkic aim for centuries now to

Unite the turkish world armenia stands in the way of that so those are certainly inconvenient i think they they will suffer um a few armenians in their territory because

They're basically intimidated into silence so i don't think it's a it's a desire to destroy every last armenian but certainly to eliminate armenia as a geopolitical presence

That stands in the way of their of their geopolitical designs one thing i know about armenians it's just the dog the dog fight in armenians it's a very unique dog fight it's so

Interesting you know when you're around it like i remember when i was in glendale i was going to glendale college the week before joining the glendale college we got into the biggest brawl in glendale college all the way down to

Verdugo just very ugly i was going and you know glendale is like the armenian capital of uh us and then i go to the army and i go to the army and the same guy we got into a fight with joined the army we were at

The same exact place i see this guy we hugged each other at the px we started crying his nickname was sleepy at the time him and his brother both joined the army and there is something very very unique

About the pride of an armenian for their heritage for their blood for who they are and i am sure the uh small armenian community that's valuetainers around the world that are watching this i uh

I encourage you to share this with your peers because this is the information that needs to get out there so more and more people are getting educated about what's going on and at the same time armenian or

Assyrian i would encourage you to do so and aram if you don't mind those links you talked about with the reparation and uh regarding the armenian genocide if you can give this to give that to us we're going to put it below

As well so the viewers can go read that we'll also put the information below how to find you and with that being said thank you so much and by the way shout out to zartonk media these are the guys that

Made the introduction and they said you ought to be the one to be a guest on valuetainment so having said that thank you so much for your time for coming and sharing the different

Challenges that's taking place between armenia and azerbaijan as well as the armenian genocide thank you so very much patrick thank you thank you so you just heard me talk to aram hamparian about the conflicts

Between armenia and azerbaijan which was very insightful i have another video for you to watch which is the one question i get asked is what is the history of the conflict between iran and u.s

I don't understand it i did a video on this topic and we went very very deep if you have not watched a clicker you'd watch it and if you've not subscribed to the channel please do so thanks for watching

Everybody take care bye

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