Alex Saunders | NuggetsNewsAU | BlockchainBrad | Crypto Convo | Bitcoin BTC | Altcoin

by birtanpublished on September 21, 2020

hey guys it's Brad Laurie or blockchain Brad and today I'm truly honored to speak with a fellow Aussie he's the biggest Alex Saunders and he also runs Nuggets news may it is truly an honor to be able to speak with you and catch up

And talk about blockchain encrypt so I'm looking forward to a Brad would be drawing a club for a while now we've finally got the time to both do it so let's get into some topics but I've also haven't never heard your full story so

I'm looking forward to hearing lockwise mate and yeah I really mean Alex it's really cool to be able to sit down and talk with a fellow Aussie we need more Aziz out there representing blockchain and crypto and yeah I also want to hear

A bit more about your story about the real deal behind what makes Alex tick NT yeah to answer you up really quickly a lot of people may not know I I started this with an interest in education I didn't know about the money side of

Crypto I didn't know about the you know many people talked about things like allocations and they talked about things like early access they talked about investment I didn't come truly with that

Agenda I entered crypto because I really genuinely believed in the value of reciprocal education and learning and I thought that was a really good way also to empower myself and others by just

Offering my own my own thoughts and most importantly learning so I spent the first probably six months just doing that really just listening to other people trying to understand with what what they think about blockchain trying

To learn from CEOs and then it just evolved from there but some I genuinely do have a love for learning about how this whole existence is an excel it's going to evolve what about you may yeah I think most people would probably agree

That when she go down the rabbit hole there's just so much to learn and it starts taking up a lot of your time so for me personally my story starts back around the GFC when I got some shares from my parents for a 21st birthday

Which shows my age and then the GFC happened and I was trying to understand how someone that gets paid to manage money full-time can may not see a crash coming so that was sort of interesting to me I started learning about the stock

Market and go and how banks work and became a bit of a gold and silver bug and then in 2012 I read an article on Zero Hedge about this thing called Bitcoin and it just sort of clicked you know as it does you find out

About this digital payment system with no banks and I just kept wanting to learn more and more about it so in 2017 the space really started to pick up because before that we had a little private Facebook group called world news

And we'd share stuff about what we thought was going to make Bitcoin go up throughout 2013 14 okay I wasn't around then I sort of entered the beginnings I guess of you know the next chapter in what you'd done after that so it's cool

To know how long you've been in this space for yeah so 2017 that the public really got aware of it and there's lots of Facebook groups you know getting into crypto and I got invited to a few of those and so many people just saying you

Know how do you even buy Bitcoin because I think we forget how much you know progress was made in 2017 so I literally just did a video on an old phone that I had at the time and upload it to YouTube and it was really bad quality and I

Thought I looked so stupid looking down into a phone and I asked another question the next day and I thought I'll do a video about that and it just sort of became this routine and next thing you know we've made a video I think

Every day for like two and a half years it's amazing every day and also Alex you know you're well known in Australia for being perhaps the leading speaker for crypto and blockchain so I generally mean this mate congratulations for all

That you have achieved because obviously it hasn't been always easy throughout this project to really sustain that interest motivate motivation and just achievement but you certainly have the respect of many people not just in

Australia but globally are you glad you did it mate are you glad you made the switch into this sort of educational role yeah thanks Brad I think sometimes you sell yourself a bit sure I think you've got 30 odd thousand followers on

Twitter so I'm a bit jealous of your Twitter following there but yeah so I was I was a pharmacist I still wear my pharmacist by trade haven't worked for a couple of years now but I was you know pretty unhappy with the job I was out

And I was so passionate about crypto and you're one of the crazy people that was sort of you know telling your friends about Bitcoin and this new thing called a theorem and just know was interested until it started going up

In price obviously so when I quit my job I finally got around to cutting back to part-time in casual then the day that I quit was actually the day become paid to $20,000 so looking back if you have oh because it's gonna go down for the next

18 months I probably wouldn't have quit but I guess you've got to take some risks and a few things happened to me that where I guess you thought you know a sign that I want to chase my passion so yeah it's been pretty tough work as I

Showing you a test to throughout crypto winter to try and make videos keep people interested and yeah I think we're coming out the other side of that now absolutely my and and also I didn't explain nothing it would be good I guess

To let your our listeners know and even just to have a chat about it ourselves is when I did start into learning about blockchain many people may not know but I started reaching out to different people that I thought really understood

This face perhaps didn't have a voice at all and I found Twitter really useful and you mentioned Twitter before but what I what I found really valuable is the steps beyond Twitter being being able to sort of engage at that level was

Really just an opening platform just some brilliant thinkers brilliant minds in this face and very quickly we we started to forge a group a research group and that coupled with my love for for education was also researching

Different block chains and it just so happened very much like you I was so fascinated by all the different startups that were emerging not knowing at the time Alex that the narrative of the day was really about white papers or fake

White papers or you know it was a real mix a real melee of credibility and very unscrupulous startups as well so I really emerged in that period of time when I got a chance to assess the veracity the variability that the

Authenticity of a team beyond the white paper and that's where it sort of led me from it was very much a research centric interest that I had but I also definitely invested at the time and it was kind of a fortuitous because it led

Me down the path of further investments but also it really taught me to be much more considered much more conscious of the kinds of risks inherent in crypto you know in that and we can talk about that today but it certainly put me in a

Good position and I you know everyone got wrecked in different ways I certainly did in different ways but I learned a lot and I'm really grateful for that experience because now at least I can reflect on that and hopefully use

That experience to build on a better future you know and how I manage my own you know digital assets and also more importantly how I you know take part in this ecosystem as well yeah so how do you go about finding those projects to

Research Brad cuz I know I know how hard it is now to find good projects into research and some of the projects I see sort of flash up on your channel just like where does Brad fly and ease and you know how do you research them that's

A good question and not many people ask but there's a few different ways that I guess every researcher has their own approach and methodology for me it's multifaceted quite literally so one way might be that I'll go and scroll through

Let's say conferences and I'll have a because often conferences they start to hint at different startups that are about to come you know they might be startups where the teams are attending but they haven't really let people know

They're still in stealth so if you do a lot of global research on different conferences around if you start to do some of that research you can start to get a sense of okay you know what are these projects and you get a billboard

Or a name and then you start to from that name follow a trail so you can do it that way another way I found really useful as well is aligning yourself with great researchers so VCS for example I've really worked hard not only to get

To know CEOs but to get to know the research arm of many of the VCS and you know it might be just a very collegial loose relationship but just having that ability to network among your colleagues just like in any industries it's really

Powerful because you sometimes you do want to be the dumbest person in that boardroom or in that context and I really do try to learn and from the knowledge of other people and even today I was talking to a colleague about some

Projects that you know that they were talking about and interested in so it's not just my own research yeah and then many I mean we could go on and on about how different ways another thing you can do is find out what other people are

Interested in for example if you go on Twitter here's a good tip and let's say you know you're interested in a particular VC or a particular person scroll through the who they follow get to know what interests them start to

Network with that because once again I think the real power this year is not just the technology it's the technology coupled with the ability for that to have uptake through the network and the narrative of that own startup so the

Strength is in not just the you know the benefits of that tech or the the best of that tech because if you look at Google for example it was the twenty first search engine it wasn't the first and so really more than ever now all

Those narratives are coming to play as really important in your own sdd and in your own research process that's interesting you say that because that's something that I haven't really done much is you know sift through

Conferences and the list but I did go to DEFCON four when it was in Sydney and I absolutely enjoyed it and we found or found out a lot more about a lousy project that used to be called Haven and they rebranded to synthetics and

Watching the presentation and I know came out thinking you know this is amazing this is in the dphi space this is going to be being and that's turned into an an absolute gem one of our best you know picks for this year but it's so

Hard to get to conferences when you're in Australia and most of them are overseas I guess so that's so true mate and especially for the cost as well for us I mean unless you can get some sort of support or sponsorship which i think

Is great if you can get some Alex because I heard about your attendance in Sydney at that efj event and a lot of people were really supportive of you attending that you also lead a lot of those meetups really well you do

Represent in that context and in life scenarios I wouldn't be as good at that I'll be honest I don't think I'd be as a confident to do it so I think as an ambassador for kind of the Australian leg of crypto you'd be great to attend

Those and and like you said you do get insights into those top-tier conferences of what those new in a new and emerging startups are planning on doing I think one of the things to add in with conferences is the risk of you know just

Expecting that all conferences are going to be the same and they're all going to have mirror and they don't some are really just conferences for conferences sake so it's also about trying to differentiate

What is a top-tier white paper in a team and what is not and that's a tough call because everything tends to align and if you do enough research you'll start to see almost a grading system of value when it comes to VCS and exchanges as

You know and so often we see you know there's an alignment between poor quality and poor outcomes in many instances yeah I think one time that I really wanted to get over to the US and go to a few of them that was when it

Just took off in 2017 and at that point it was almost he could feel that it wasn't going to be worth going you could feel that it was going to be all icos and you know there was so many youtubers back in and everyone was just doing the

Same same stuff so I think that the dust is started to settle some ways I actually had that exact experience you know how I was talking about that research group I started with we ended up going over for consensus I think in

The year you're talking about and I never forget it because when we went in to that sort of lobby area it was overwhelming so much so I really did want to go back home to Australia pretty much that day because the conference

Wasn't about you know what technology what teams what are you building it wasn't about that true philosophy that we sort of entered in the space to see technological innovation it was literally it was like you know those

Speed-dating scenarios it really was accept that this was all about how quickly can everyone you know find out about the next she'll happen everyone get to the next 10x because they were literally rushing from meeting to

Meeting in the lobby yeah I guess it kind of has it's good and bad doesn't it like we we kind of know it was a bubble and we've always thought that 99% of projects are going to fail but at the same time in the dot-com bubble you need

Over investment and exuberance to get people to come to an industry and the good projects to succeed so I think it's a kind of similar thing and this regulation coming in the space changing but I think a lot of people would have

Learned their lesson and they wouldn't still be vest investing in I SEOs even if the regulation hadn't changed at all I think but I don't do you agree with that I totally do and honestly make that when we first started there was

Certainly a lot more questionable startups I mean I remember I think you've even talked about this I'm not sure what the numbers are back in those those times in 2017 but it was substantial how many were emerging and

By day it just seemed like there was this bottomless pit of startups but the issue back then was many of them were very empty they were very they were all built for profit an engineered release for that short shield they weren't

Really any think more of true substance but now like you're alluding to is that we're seeing a more reductionist approach and that less is more philosophy on quality over quantity yeah and even a return to the old projects

Was something that I've been talking about and you see like recently d creds been getting a bit more hype on social media you know red fox labs building on top of comodo things like auger and you know golems these projects that were

Actually set out to be decentralized and do things are kind of coming back into favor whereas how many ideas can you possibly do people tried everything and everything and a lot of it didn't need a token or didn't need to be decentralized

Yeah yeah and a space can get well I don't know if it'll ever get saturated I'm just not sure if that's the fair turn but it does feel like we need to focus and honing on the assets that are already existent really exploring what

Already is there as those different layers that make up the Eco whether that be layer 1:02 as you know and right now we have significant infrastructural capacity there for the tanking for the making of

The next you know decade of blockchain innovation and applications but much of that is clouded by and we definitely I'm sure going to talk about that and that is the crypto casino aspect the speculation aspect the the the sort of

Interplay between tech and what is this anomalous space that we do see called the crypto sphere or crypto space I mean it really is a valuable sort of discussion to have because even today you still see a lot of pump and dumps

You still see a lot of short-term success but like you're saying is that we are both proponents of that long game we both really want to see this work yeah definitely my investing thesis has kind of been investing very small

Amounts in projects that are and you know sort of letting them go for three to five years and if they're not taking off things on their roadmap then sell them and and move on but you've got to be prepared that something is going

To work and some things are going to fail but if you pick wisely it's like venture capital investing these things do 10 20 a hundredfold returns so you've got to be prepared to have some losses and as long as you're doing your

Research and having more winners and I believe most people should have a fair bit of Bitcoin and too many people are hundred percent out coins and then the cycle changes we're seeing at the moment dominance is up and just when everyone

Throws the towel and gives up old coins we'll probably have another run again it's just such sentiment driven speculation and trading is a huge part of the ecosystem but that's probably going to change as you say towards find

Their mentors and business models yeah and I mean it's it's great to know also that you are so transparent about your portfolio not a lot of people are but clearly and you right from the go get you've always been a real proponent of

BTC and I am NOT you know as vocal about perhaps they're the inner workings of any specific coin but I'm not by any means an t BTC you know Lowe people suggest because I talk about a lot of projects I might be but it's not that

It's just that already that it has such a strong networking narrative and it has such a strong brand and it doesn't really need you know as much of an educational platform like many of these others and certainly you know there are

There are nuances you know associated with sort of the emotive aspect of this as a lot of people were very emotive ly charged or emotionally charged when it comes to BTC but I really wanted to ask you underneath the narrative underneath

The network Alex what what is it about BTC that really got your attention that really really made you want to put your money where your mouth is and just drop that in as the major part of your portfolio well back in the day it was a

Small amount of money for me because I you know I was just graduating uni so I didn't buy Bitcoin back in 2012 and pump you know I didn't know if thousands of dollars in my bank account put it that way so it was a small investment with my

Dad as well he was sort of interested when I told him about it and it was a payment network in a digital world where everything is digital and instant you know we can have these high-definition chats

And we had Facebook at the time and yet as someone that had lived in England for a little bit if I want to send money over there costs a fortune to do that and get ripped off in fees so as soon as I just knew the basics about Bitcoin

That you could send money to anyone in the world instantly and throughout the time it was you know basically free or very low fee that was the first thing that sold me and then you kind of go down the rabbit hole and you learn about

Either blockchain this is how proof of work runs this is why I can't get attacked so I think now I view Bitcoin as one of the most computer system secure some computer systems in the world now that sort of that gets thrown

Around with that terminology because their ass cheeks are good at doing the Bitcoin algorithm but technically they're not good at doing much else so you can't really say it's the most secure computer network in the world

That gets thrown around on Twitter but I do think we're going to see other projects piggyback off that so I think it's a las dos has emerged mining and Komodo are piggybacking off Bitcoin for security so bitcoins value has just been

That secure network other things to pay for themselves – I think he's going to grow in the future and now it's been seen as a store of value because of the digital scarcity so the same arguments as gold that people like to compare as

Well so hopefully it becomes a payment network for some countries maybe it's not far other countries that have good infrastructure like Australia but I think bitcoin is so many different things to different people depending if

You're in Argentina tonight or you know it just that's what I think people forget about Bitcoin that it's a global asset right now Alex I'm so glad we're talking about this mate because you again being a proponent you know a lot

About you know workings of Bitcoin and right now when I go in and trying to educate myself I'll go to someone like Andreas Antonopoulos or I'll listen to different debates happening in the space and often what I've noticed is that

There are camps inside the the wider picture of the I guess the BTC narratives and in like one of them you're saying is about payments it's about settlement it's about even currency but then there are others who

Argue that sov is the fundamental digital you know purpose or the digitally and the purpose of the digital assets I wanted to ask you what's your view given that there are all of these for the fraction

And sort of broken camps perhaps within the wider picture and what a frame with BTC yeah so I guess it all comes back to that point about the white paper being a p2p electronic cash system and this is where the Bitcoin cash guys say that you

Know fees are too high it's no longer that real p2p some cash system but then you sort of got to ask well what is money and value and as money need to have a store of value aspect before it can be used as a method of payment so

That's why there's all these different ideologies but I guess I'm a firm believer that the Bitcoin developers are taking his path where it's got to be very slow and steady because there's 200 million dollars at stake now and if they

Make one little mistake then maybe that does irreparable damage to be coins brand name whereas aetherium have had the Dow hack and other problems but they're kind of going for that move fast and break things and experiment angle so

Yeah I hope the Bitcoin and the Lightning Network keeps improving and privacy so that aspects are going to come into it as well but I kind of think that if Bitcoin didn't change anything at all and stayed the same as it is it

Still has a story value and you can still use it for payments for large amounts across borders so still has lots of great things going for it even if at the moment fees get a bit high for the people who want to send a dollar to

Someone else right and that's what I want to talk to you about mate because you said that one of the reasons you got into it was because of that transmittance you know that we can transfer value and I agree with you

Having Aziz love to travel so if we can make it easy while we're doing that this ought to send money to our loved ones you know that's great but right now in 2019 the many of the we had this word in crypto called Hodler

Which many are familiar with do you think that that's still the primary use case for Bitcoin you know I really mean this because right now we still see the narrative of buying to hold then eventually to sell it some of their

Asset to capitalize you know for things or for fiat do you think that's still the primary use case for BTC oh that's a great question so I see if you zoom out and have a look at the macro environment which is something that I love to talk

About what's going with money printing and negative interest rates and you couldn't even have predicted these things five or ten years ago so with all that happening Bitcoin has even more of a use case and

A lot of people are viewing it as a speculative investment and that's fine because it's volatile at the moment but if this continues down this path then what happens if we have the other recession and we go to deeply negative

Interest rates but then what happens when we come out the other side of that and ten years later we have another downturn are they going to take you no we're gonna go to negative ten percent are they going to be having to print

Hundreds of trillions of dollars so I think a lot of people but this is where a lot people go wrong they sell too early so a lot of people are good at trading or handling money in the emotion that comes with it so I'd probably never

Sell all my Bitcoin ever because I think where it's going on term you know unless something changes and there's an in the code and we have to admit the wrong something like that but yeah I really think that people in more and more

Countries everyday are realizing that geez I'm losing my perch in car and inflation is higher and what's gonna happen in the next recession you know my wages aren't growing the money systems not working for me there's so many

Reasons for people wanting to park their value for their kids or for long-term in some sort of asset that's outside the dangers right and and let's say that continues let's say you know many of you even hypothesized about the prospective

Value some talk about 100k for example won't ask you to say a number but the reality is that many people who are Pro BTC want to see it really escalate in value now in that case it's almost a bit of a

Crypto conundrum because if you see you know traditional patterns of currency development over history they tend to graduate to a more stable mechanism do you think that's almost paradoxical or antithetical to the very narrative of

People wanting it to continue to snowball in value yeah it definitely is in the sort of short to medium term because a good currency shouldn't be too volatile as you say so I see decentralized stable coins like to

Make a die being really important and that was one of the first projects that we that we covered but I think Bitcoin is going to this large market cap so I think it is capturing market share of gold or Forex you know off

Of different currencies so to get to those big market caps you know they're in the trillions of dollars then it's going to be a rocky ride so we have these big run ups and then all the sudden you've got some investors that

Have made a lot of money and traders and they sell and that's going down and people get emotional and scared and it goes down 80 percent and then all the sudden we start growing again with everything that's happening in this

Ecosystem so I actually think it's just part and parcel of making our way to a really large market cut and now that we have more you know products and even the ability for traders to short it actually helps stabilize the market as they take

Profits so maybe in the next cycle I actually think that we could definitely get up towards a hundred thousand in the next sort of four year Bitcoin hiring cycle and and you know 20 years from now I do think we could get to a million

Dollars per Bitcoin and along the way maybe the next downturn is only 50 percent correction and the one after that is only a 30 percent correction and then you say well you know the Aussie dollar has gone down 30 percent in the

Past couple years so also in Bitcoin is just as stable there's a lot of world currencies right that's a way of you it's really interesting because you're sort of in the camp of suggesting there's an amalgam of it being a

Commodity it being a currency at some point really evidencing that in perhaps in the future being more more clear but also it being a utility some argue for one or the other so it's really fascinating to see how different

Academics or even how different speakers of Bitcoin really color today but I didn't want to ask you when Andreas Antonopoulos for example I'm sure you know him he talks about this concept of sound money in that context you know

Given that today we still see that the narrative of investment and literally the word assets being thrown in as a means of storing it valuing it as something that eventually you can sell to again engage you in purchases of

Goods and services in some other way yes do you think that you know his argument is going to be paramount in the future that it evolved into and fundamentally sound money above you know something that is store yeah I think it is good

And make governments and central banks more once a ball because I know bitcoin is volatile and people say well what if you bought the top but if you look at it statistically it's gone up for 98.7

Percent of the time and in certain countries it's going up 99 or 100 percent it's actually at all-time highs I think if you're in Venezuela is a bad way or whatnot so for those people when Andreya stops about this about maybe

Earning their wage in Bitcoin and we saw a New Zealand legalized it you can get a bit of your wages paid in Australia already with a little company called get paid in Bitcoin so if all the countries and governments go down this path of

Being fiscally irresponsible with printing money and whatnot a lot of people gonna say well I'm gonna get more and more of my wages in Bitcoin and comparatively that is going to hold its value better now maybe you don't want to

Get 100% of your wages in Bitcoin because it does have another 70% downturn in future or you need it to pay for things week to week or even minute to minute it's too volatile so you still have maybe other currencies or even

Stable coins for payments along the way until bitcoin is really mature but I just think as Bitcoin is this sort of layer 0 of the whole global what is value soar the question just as we used to have gold and then on top of that you

Can have cash and then on top of that we have Visa and MasterCard as a payment system so I think Bitcoin could just be this ultimate settlement layer maybe the u.s. refuses to use it but if everyone else is using it because their

Currencies are starting to be too volatile and we'd get hyperinflation in maybe half a dozen currencies in another year's time then people gonna say well and we've got this thing that's digital it's programmed we know its inflation

Rate let's use it right and in that context you know you've seen the emergence of stable coins as well and often you know the conduct the premise there is to try and enable more global trade and more transparent trade because

As you know that watching is relatively transparent but if we see the emergence of these stable coins how does it render BTC in that context Alex you know if we see for example in history with every innovation every technological era we've

Seen progress literally in that tech stack so the first development isn't always the one that's adopted finally and then has that global adoption that mass adoption so when it when we move forward we talk

About this the context of BTC whether it gets the mass adoption as that settlement layer or as the global currency do you see are you concerned at all about the emergence of other players in that space if we're

Talking about you and I being able to be paid in these currencies yes oh definitely as a method of payment is competition at the moment with a are the coins that have like instant and felis transactions

They're better than Bitcoin as a method of payment at the moment now maybe if you want to send a hundred million dollars maybe the security of the Bitcoin network is even better than you having an instant free transaction

Because you're you know that security is worth $1 to you so you know I think it's different things to different people but definitely in competition as a method of payment but if you tie this back to say Libra that wants to come out with this

Ultimate basket stable coin right if over time if you had half a dozen people in a suburb earning their wages in Libra and earning in Bitcoin overtime I think we're going to see that those people that Bitcoin and more they hold more

Value they increased their wealth so comparatively people say oh yes this is more stable day-to-day for paying for things but as a store of wealth and over the long term I think Bitcoin absorbs more value right and what do you say – I

Was listening to one of the VCS in San Francisco speak about this one of the members of the VC of a prominent one and I tweeted about this one of them was saying last year that they felt that that like you're saying other

Transactional platforms other other blockchain base startups that are more designed for that currency based system we're doing better you know they made it very clear but they said that nothing does better than

BTC when it comes to storing you know an asset do you feel that some of these VCS are dichotomizing this narrative for their own pockets and for their own profit because I'll allude to one person a Wednesday's name but there's one very

Well-known speaker in space who has 50 percent of his assets just in BBC and he tells everyone about it you know and when you're a frontline speaker obviously you're going to be advocating for you know the value of your own

Holdings so do you think that some of them are centralized simply because of their own portfolios yeah so I mean I don't my own aiming pump he's a friend of mine as well but they've definitely got an interest and

That's a great example of when you follow someone on Twitter you've got to know what lens they're fair viewing it for and what's their narrative they're pushing so yeah definitely take anything that anyone says from any community with

A grain of salt because it's frustrating for me someone who loves aetherium to watch the fear and crowd bash Bitcoin sometimes so right but yeah everyone has their own little sort of favorites I guess you'd say but getting back to the

Question yeah there's a big incentive for those people at the moment that are building investment funds and if you're viewing it as hey Park 1% of your wealth in Bitcoin and to hedge against global uncertainty it's the new digital gold

That's the story that's kind of been sold then to a lot of people that that is appealing we've had some property you know highly inflated at the moment many would argue what and you know it's like insurance it's an option on your

Portfolio so I think we forget how small and allocation people have something like gold worldwide sovereign funds and why not it's just become this boring asset and bitcoin is this even tiny little sliver of gold at the moment so

It only takes a really small fraction of people to park a tiny bit of money for these things to explode in value right and then there's the complexity complexity of the legalities and the terminological issues in Australia you

Know them very well you teach this stuff but we talk about blockchain being fundamentally borderless but when it comes to the jurisdictional sort of pressures that League legalities put on to this whole ecosystem do you think

That's an issue in itself in how each country determines the validity of this technology yeah so let's say China for example or India China's ban became like eight times in the seven years or would not of been

Bitcoin and we've seen in you do it recently and it's sad for a company like Zeb pay in India that we're doing a great job to have to move away but what it does is push it into the black markets or gray markets whatever we want

To call them and it actually gives between a premium it's a little bit like the war on drugs you know you make something illegal people want to because they're curious nature and the Cossack can't come into the country and

There's no industry around it the price of drugs in countries where they're illegal is far far higher than those countries where they're legal so it's that's kind of one of the arguments I see any of the day governments can only

Regulate the on ramps and off ramps so that's another reason why Andres talks about earn your wage in Bitcoin you know a gives you more an amenity online you're not relying on an exchange to buy and sell and people say well you can't

Pay for anything your Bitcoin this half-a-dozen debit cards now like 10x that will let you pay for things are we Bitcoin and websites like living room with Satoshi so I think it's just becoming an option for people to use if

Governments are fiscally irresponsible right and mate it was interesting to to hear you talk about Libra because that really changed the game when it comes to top-down sort of interest in crypto that was the narrative that went global

Simply because of the the parties that were speaking about blockchain and what work can do for their an interest and and and then there was a narrative of the corporate coin you know thrown into the mix Andreas is not a fan as you

Would know but many people are excited about the conversation being had from the top so in that context mate corporations and government well how do you see those two parties playing you know out in this very convoluted space

And what what could they potentially do to reform and reshape the way in which we engage in crypto now yeah I think that's a Libra is a highly controversial project in some countries and that's why I don't think it's going to go ahead in

The means that he gets full global traction because there's gonna be so many people to say no we're not letting Facebook become the World Bank and have power over our citizens value because if it's another out you know it's an outlet

If a country is struggling and the government has all their value going into Facebook into a us-based corporation they're just not going to allow that so the other thing that got people talking about was the scale of

Centralized diversity centralized so you'd probably argue that Bitcoin or theorem with 10,000 full nodes it's pretty decentralized you can't shut that down and then we have the scale with things like EOS and

Mayo that I've got the trade off and from another speed and whatnot and a lot of people bask them and say that centralize that's not that's decentralized because we still get to vote for the nodes and but at the end of

The day if Facebook come out and they have 21 at the moment or they're trying to get a hundred corporations and it's not that different to the model that some of these crypto projects are doing except we didn't elect them they paid

Ten million dollars to join this corporation coin so to speak so it's really getting people thinking about maybe those different nuances that they didn't really consider previously right and also the fact that there is this

Dual mechanism this dual currency design suppose in that they have an investment coin potentially in their architecture they also have a stable coin that is designed to really potentially enfranchise more global trade and

Facebook are arguing that they are separating their interest as Facebook to Libre and obviously basing it on you know the backing of Calibra but do you feel that it's going to be sustained given that in history we've certainly

Seen the opposite and that interests have collided and it's been you know self-serving interests for the corporations that start something like this eventually you know with clauses that we don't simply you know read when

We sign up to things like Facebook yes oh I watched both of the hearings in Congress and Senate so nine hours worth and I actually find that stuff fascinating and they were you know putting Facebook through the ring and so

You know you're not doing this out of the goodness of your heart Facebook and with your track record and Google and Visa and MasterCard have just decided that everyone needs a cheaper fairer payment system so I definitely think

That the regulators are going to push back really hard and Facebook Webb said oh it's non-for-profit and yet these people paying ten million dollars to run a node and they've talked about the second coin as you said which sounds

Like an sto or a Curie split so that's why I can never be ultimately better than a true cryptocurrency because they are still going to have to collect the fee or make money somehow and it has you know I did a white board session with

The the teks versus the glass I thought actually is good and it just can't compete on all the things that make a blockchain and cryptocurrency great right and made in the future we've seen certain parties in Asia particularly I

Mean even in Europe seem to the standard indicate interest in Libra because obviously the US has reacted what are your sort of what's your prediction with regards to what will happen Libra do you think it's still

Going to evolve regardless given that it has a foundation in Switzerland yes I think if it goes ahead it is going to have a lot of users there's people that are going to use this and maybe it's just to buy their movie tickets or it

Becomes a bit like the WeChat in China so I think it would be you know arrogant to say Libra is never going to work because Facebook have two billion users and they're going to make it easy to use product which is something that crypto

Space hasn't done well so far for people but I just think at the end of the day it's gonna get more people talking about cryptocurrency and Bitcoin when they see that Bitcoin going up in value in the next bull market and they say why

Doesn't Libra go up in value they just get that basic notion of a stable coin versus Bitcoin as a store of value just gonna get people really start understanding these concepts right and they you know it's interesting because

As Aziz one of the words we probably don't like to use is influencer and we hear that word thrown around a lot but you know the reality is that many of the frontline speakers whether they be someone like home or someone like us you

Know there's a degree of responsibility inherent in having that frontline position now in that context what do you what are you what's your sentiments regard to influences like what do you think when it comes to the

Responsibilities are we fulfilling that role right now and are we doing good job yeah that's a great question so I don't really like that that word either but influences I guess in the global social media space have become way more

Prominent so you know people with a lot of followers on Instagram or Facebook they have a lot of power these days and advertisers pay them a lot of money and we saw the same thing happen in the crypto space so I know you and I are

Both others found it hard at times to survive with it because we've chosen not to do you know the SEO token promotion so yeah for us we had to personally find other avenues like education and more recently working

You know the good reputable exchanges if they want to sponsor your podcast and they're not going to steal your audience something so yeah I think there's ways we can survive but I guess yeah I've always tried to come in at same angles

You have being very ethical but people are wising up to it I think now where a lot of people are still pushing iOS or ICO at the end of the day how many good projects can there possibly be and there's going to come a time when the

Rubber hits the road as we like to say we're people who hold on all these projects were failing they got pumped right and I'm really glad we're bringing this up because obviously intention is not to you know attack any persist

Specific person but really raised the issue raised the potential risks of this this pattern we've seen emerge and that is you know there's this opportunity the opportunism that's really challenged the whole purpose of of being an educator in

This face now you alluded to education being a premise I feel the same and it is true that it is really difficult to survive and make a living in crypto and try and retain as much of your ethics and the morals as you can because it's

Tough you know talk about stuff in this crypto environment where things are monetized it's always the risk in doing it but inherent in all this now especially in the ieo phase proposed ico we see a lot of this these wrappings

Discussions of BTC with very implicit and and sort of nuanced messages of certain altcoins you know as the term goes or as with other startups but many of the parties who are speaking are really advocating for you know

Consolidation into BTC or they might be paid in BTC for their representation of that coin there's a lot of problems I think going on that many people aren't willing to talk about and doesn't require us to target anyone but really

Just to raise the question of are you really paying attention to what's really going on yeah and I mean I've got friends in the space to do do the paid model and I don't really have a problem with that as long as they're disclosing

And just because of project he's paying someone to talk about it that doesn't mean that a might not end up being a hidden gem and being really successful down there so yeah it's a fine line and I guess

It's all about building a relationship with your audience and Trust which is what we've always tried to do because long-term I think that's what trumps everything and we've already seen that take place a little bit with the the

Washout of a lot of youtubers and ICO reviews and that with crypto winter so some strong thoughts on all that right well you know mate I tend to really agree with you you know sorry about the headphones but yeah I mean I I'll just

Fix that so I tend to agree with you also mate with regard to you know the transparency you know end of the day if people are really upfront if they're truly representing their their truth as an educator and as

Someone in the space I think that's what we're what we're asking for any any representative whether they've been influenced are whether they be a speaker and as a VC or someone who is a research member of it it really doesn't matter

The the most important thing is that people are really upfront because there's a lot of different layers you know to this whole process has taken a long time for us both to learn what it is to really know crypto 100% and I

Remember the story I tell is a coin called aurora coin in 2014 there was one of the first old coin cycles and it was going to be the official coin of Iceland and I got FOMO and lost money in that and that the cycle comes again so it's

Not the first time it happened in 2017 and I think it's going to happen again it will look different and won't be the same as 2017 but my advice has always been that I think 99% of projects are probably going to fail in the next five

Years and investing a small amount into the ones that you like so that if you have these losers it doesn't affect you because I think the beers problem we see is people with huge exposures to just these random old coins and even if

They're not a scam even if they mean well maybe they can't get developers maybe they run out of funding maybe someone else does their idea better so there's so many things that can go wrong and I know personally it's still it's

Hard not to fall in love with ideas and projects sometimes if you get that it's a startup in the tech world exactly a night and want to ask you as well and given that you even today a lot of people talk about BTC as king there's a

Strong discussion this year about equality you know and the discussion using the Gini coefficient trying to assess whether or not BTC fundamentally is a true representative of fairness whatever that means because it is so

Subjective but when we talk about just in terms of economic prosperity globally let's get real and real about their stakeholders in BTC do you feel that it's a fair or reasonable or even equitable representation for the kind of

Ideals for the kind kind of a white paper that I did purport to have if we use numbers for example like two percent of the stakeholders have you know that's the such a substantial amount of value in BTC yeah so I'm not a common

Economists but here's the way that I tend to think about it what we've seen in the current financial system is inequality getting worse particularly since we had QE and the GFC a lot of assets have gone up in price the wealthy

Have benefited and at other end of the spectrum the average guy on the street now needs to take out a huge loan to buy a car go to school and then try and get a B to build or Sydney so they're hurting a lot so don't know the spectra

On the inequality is getting worse now in Bitcoin we've got early adopters you can see the top 100 addresses no they're pretty wealthy guys they're the whales but a lot of them haven't moved coins in them

And sold and that shows to me if they're not selling at 20,000 you know they're here for the long term and a lot of them have made a lot of money and a lot of them have the cypherpunk sort of you know ethos that how much money is too

Much if I've got a million dollars in a great house I don't need to dump a hundred million on the market at the moment you know I'm pretty set for the long term so I think Bitcoin gets spent more and adopted more news more sort of

Makes its way through the ecosystem and as Andres says hopefully more people start to earn it as well well there's a data suggestion and that's being reiterated by many of the different you know whales even but even the VCS who

Really push forward I'm sure Novogratz for example would it would argue this or even Brian Armstrong many of them are saying that the data suggests that there's an increasing distribution because as you know

Move in time many of these whales time to offload some of their holdings you know for you know obviously their own interests whether they want to go and cash out into Fiat or what they want to buy goods and services like you said we

Can are the the thing is distribution is increasing but I do want to ask you though in the sense of global and fairness and global equality while global distribution of wealth are we talking about that from a financial

Standpoint do you think that we are risking rehashing and reinventing the age-old problem of inequality because of the fact that these people exist with such significant holdings whether or not they be good actors or not yeah I mean

We definitely run that risk but if we pivot slightly so let's talk about mining so a lot of people say that's very centralized because of the you know the mining farms and whatnot but the reality is a lot of people can join

Those poles from a different location in Australia and I join a Chinese pool so I think mining is a great example of something that was dominated by bit main and now there's other manufacturers there's competition and that's probably

Going to become more decentralized as the asacs base gets more competitive so maybe the average guy can actually hook up and Asik with some friends and he's got renewables solar farm in outback Australia and you know they're going to

Be over to mine so I think that alone also helps disperse coins particularly if we have you know renewable energy takes off in developing nations and someone builds a solar farm in in Africa and they hook it up to Bitcoin and miner

To help pay it off and bring money into the local community the other side of that is we're Simas already in Asia and Australia competition so there's high wages in Australia for say an architect now once we have good internet and we

Move this online task economy maybe there's an architect in Asia that's $10 an hour and they do just as good a job so it's a bit like a water level and now that we can pay people with crypto currencies it's possible to pay that

Architect $100 to do you know 10 hours work we don't have to pay a bank $100 international transfer fee yeah exactly and we've both done that as Aussies because it is so expensive considering we had so few

Options really when it comes to the major banks now right when it comes to just obviously trading is a common fit some scenario we see now is beyond just a speculation we see write daily trading do you think that is also aligned with

You know what you signed up for because we see people trying to profit here from very quick movement in the volatility that is inherent in all crypto is that is that consolidating the potential of this whole system or is that a challenge

To it yeah I definitely don't think that's part of Satoshi's vision was people going 100 X on beat backs but I mean I do enjoy training I think like the stock market it's probably become way too prevalent with all the bots and

Our goes and I did a video on this recently as well but it's bringing people into the space a lot of them are speculating maybe they come for the money and maybe a few of them do learn about the tech and the ethos and they

They start a movement and they tell some friends so yeah I think volatility is something that burns a lot of beginners and how easy it is to hop on an exchange and trade 100 X and they wish they hadn't they wish they had have learned

How to trade or not done at all so yeah I don't think it's something that I'd say is healthy or that great for this space but it's part of the game I guess part of the learning curve of getting into the world of crypto right and mate

What do you think about this scenario that's playing out now and quite sincerely if you listen to enough people who really educate us on Bitcoin capitalism comes up as a topic because an often it's a very Pro capitalistic

Scenario many arguing for the fairness of the open a free market you know enables you know potentially our globalized you know borderless scenario but we've seen already those those iterations happen in history pre

Blockchain and pre crypto and do you think that capitalism is really overused as potentially an excuse for some of the capitalization on using crypto and why I ask this is because let's use some examples let's say you the white-collar

American or you know the white-collar Australian or really really anyone in that developed region whose just had the benefits of having access to first of all the cryptographic knowledge that existed in 2019 or say

Through to 15 engaged in crypto because of that access and then from there so to play with it as an investment instrument as a means in which try and they were trying to increase their own financial position as opposed to let's say you're

Someone in South America or someone in developing regions where you're literally trying to utilize that to just survive do you see what I'm getting out is that the paradox here is the intent that the purpose is there any point are

We getting to a dichotomies ation of how people really need this to work yeah I see people in the investing world are trying to value what something will be worth at a given point down the road so maybe those people that are speculating

That don't need it as much as the community in Africa they're speculating on that community in Africa really meeting this and adopting this in the future so does pushing up in value help reduce the volatility that helps make it

A better currency you know I don't know the question Alex I need from your brother because we need to know that our friends in Africa and South America can use Bitcoin for their ends you know to suit their needs and isn't that going to

Happen if we keep driving the price of BTC up I think it definitely can so I definitely think that people will start thinking about things in terms of Satoshi's and maybe stable coins build that bridge in the mean time when

There's too much volatility as we already touched on in terms of capitalism I think the ico for all the bad that came of it being able to move value around the world and we talked to start in Australia and they say there's

No appetite for investing in startups in Australia let alone tech startups so the fact that people could have a good idea and raise money from anywhere around the globe and from the little guy the little guy can put $100 into a startup with a

Good idea but he supports I think they are revolutionary concepts allowing value to flow frictionlessly around the globe right and and obviously there's a lot of support for the model that is proof-of-work which underpins Bitcoin

But do you think also that you've given the mechanics of her work because it's very mechanical operation it's a very algorithmic design as you know solving a puzzle puzzle on the blockchain but do you think that's

Appropriated or misappropriated in the context of proving work because we're going to talk about capitalism often inherent in that is doing the work you know if you do the work you get the results you get the reward you get the

Entrepreneurs benefit but the risk in appropriating that is perhaps to support the argument that is often very a very egocentric it's very self-serving you know comes from that premise of III rather than we we we but when does the

Conversation of giving back when does the conversation of supporting your fellow men in the context of all of this financial you know development all this prosperity this financial and economic prosperity when does that start to come

Into the conversation as well because right now Alex we see a lot of read yes there's certainly a lot of greed and people trying to get rich quick I'd also say that the Bitcoin community have been the biggest supporters of a lot of

Libertarian movements where in whether it's Assange or maps I'm not sure if you're familiar with the research they do on psychedelic drugs and there's huge coin donations go to them because no money would go to them from corporations

Or the pharmaceutical industry so I think there's a lot of people that are wealthy doing doing good things getting back to proof of work I think if you made it any easier than Bitcoin would have already been attacked by now you

Know a banker government could could wipe it out so it has to be die hard again it comes back to what is Bitcoin worth how much would it cost you to buy however many a hundred thousand a Sikhs are around the globe you know build that

Infrastructure it would probably cost more than bitcoins market cap at the moment so that network itself I see have another value right well clearly you know you have a lot to say when it comes to Bitcoin mate I'm you know you've been

In the game for a long time looking back is there anything that you would change you know if you started again or I you know are you satisfied that you know this is just something process Oh Brad I've made that many

Mistakes and hacks and all the stuff that happened on the wild ride I do a lot of things differently but I'm actually a believer that everything happens for a reason so if I hadn't of lost those bitcoins in the early days

Wouldn't have found a theorem and never started its music so yeah I've quite enjoyed the right I think people learn a lot about themselves and what about investing and the way the world works which is I know

Sounds kind of cheesy but once they go down the rabbit hole learn about Bitcoin and other Kryptonian what about the future you know if we were going to use the the impossible crystal ball and let people know what we're thinking how

Would you paint you know the next few years of crypto a blockchain innovation and really you know the way in which things are going so I see the big issues being scaling and at the moment between he's trying to make itself as efficient

As possible before increasing the block size because then it makes it harder to run a full node and have bandwidth in developing countries so that's kind of the debate that's you know hotly discussed on social media and with only

Is privacy I see I made vehicle the number one headwind for Bitcoin and the theorem and all coins really is they're implementing privacy so we see today coinbase announced that the listings e-cash and i should say that you know we

Saw japan crackdown on privacy claims so it's this whole battle about you know what is privacy and what are human rights should someone be able to give value to another person without that being tracked so I really see that as a

Big discussion that could maybe cause a two-year crypto winter after we go to a hundred thousand in three s time you know it's just it's never going to be a smooth ride just up and to the right on the chart and I really want to ask you

This because you know I'm not a big fan of the term but many people throw out the the other term of altcoin because of Bitcoin what are your thoughts on the maximalist agenda compared to everything else and I really wanted to ask you this

Well is short what are your thoughts on the word coin since it was literally thrown out and used in Congress yeah I mean I'm not someone that swears that much I guess when you hear that coming out of

Congressman was house and mouth it's be like okay yeah i think i think it's just become the common terminology and it's a fine line because i think there's a lot of crap and a lot of scams out there so in some ways people are right to call

Them coins the terminology came from an alternate coin to be coin and it's the the name cryptocurrency these were all currencies to begin with whereas now i really think people are moving to digital assets i agree with

Some of these aren't trying to be currencies at all so try and as a Milton pointed out in her discussion at Congress is it often Krypton can also be regarded with regard in the light of cryptographic you know representation a

Cryptography behind that underpins many of these technologies yeah and obviously I'm pretty favorite look pretty favorably on a Furion and I think something like that maybe they get futures next and another investment

Product and if they move to 2.0 successfully you know at what point do you say this is a hundred billion dollar asset we've got a stock referring it to it as an altcoin can you imagine you've you know you know

Facebook and then we just caught if if you know that's why I was to ask you exactly because we see even and Antonia Andreas has argued that we see the programmability of Hysterium really emerge and distinguish itself from BTC

In its fundamentals you know that the smart contract really was you know through solidity was really trying to develop on from the BTC code now in that context surely there's you know there's financial instruments whether they be a

Units of account whether it be currencies whatever they're deemed whether they be regarded as digital assets and that's a commodity such as aetherium and surely they have their own infrastructure their own ecosystem and

Should be validated and respected as such yep I think it's just the fact that the those people that would be doing and the naming of these investment products it's all it's all brand new and hasn't even happened yet so the people that are

Left to do it other tribes crypto Twitter the youtubers you know so it's sort of everyone's running blind and we don't know what's going to happen yet it's possible theorem fails in Ione other platforms as

Well it's possible that they fail but yeah at what point do you say there's thousands of developers working on thousands of projects on top of the theorem it deserves a bit of respect at hundra's has written a book about it I

Don't think we can just keep calling it a null point right and mate I want to talk to you also just about the way in which branding plays a significant role because we talked about influences but the reason why is because even today we

Still see a huge push for BTC branding what what if we wanted to quantify that as some sort of point of value how important is consistent branding to crypto when perhaps there isn't over correlations between the token and the

Growth of their own startup so you mean for other projects and how they relate to the the token with their name and the branding of the project well even BTC because a lot of people say because it's leaderless and so Satoshi you know has

Taken you know a significant step back and just observes that but if you look at it more in the macro level it's more the the participants in terms of the investors you know those who are really playing a significant part in the

Narrative of values they say for example right now we see similarly scarce tokens such as quite network for example or you know we could go on with many other examples but many people start to really you know support the brand that they are

Invested in whether that be BTC or any startup beyond the team themselves so how important does it become when these really emotive groups emerged whether they be BTC or whether they be in these other startups because it seems like

They can really change the outcome of the price yeah so I I definitely think that communities at the moment and speculation are driving the price of the smaller projects but I like the analogy of Bitcoin is that honeybadger that just

Gets stronger no matter what gets thrown at it so you know bitcoins had all these hard Forks now which is a free market saying that we think ours is better and look at them they're performing terribly compared to Bitcoin we've seen you know

The China Bear India bear mining ban so all these things have happened and yet these coins gone from having no value to worth $10,000 per Bitcoin so every year this happens and it's now 10 years and people are actually saying

That we here macro commentators saying this network has survived for 10 years without being hacked and it just keeps producing a block every 10 minutes it's doing its thing so I just don't think that you can ever replicate that first

Mover and that brand name and that network effects that come we'd be quite remote so you're a real proponent of the narrative of BTC being king yeah in terms of other things being better as a method of payment we've discussed that

Today but you just can't we can't make Brad coin and know the coin and tell people that it has value because you can send it from A to B and it's faster or it's private the value comes from the network affection everyone else

Believing and the other 10,000 coins just don't have the store of value of the ten year track record the belief I think that's the big point that that point of belief you know that the fact that there is that you know history of

Support and there's been significant number of bubbles that in and from that whenever a bubble happens typically in economics that can't that can crash a startup very fast but this is being a consistent reemergence from several

Different iterations we've seen in history so it certainly does suggest that there's a strong grassroots support for whatever you know we we did deem this to be but I just jump in quickly Brad and say look at like when it's been

The silver to bitcoins gold that's tested the new implementations like Segway it's got lining Network we if Bitcoin gets really busy again people are going to use white coin again look at edge coin it's got a market cap with

350 million dollars and it's a joke project but it's got a strong community a lot of OGIS in there it stood the test of time now so they're the sort of things which sometimes people look for a flashy website and and that doesn't mean

Right and does it surprise you also Alex that we genuinely see even in the top let's say top 20 there are literally joke projects in there you know technologically in a few years time we're going to see that empirically

Shown but do you think that it's got to the point 2019 where many of the participants in this what is relatively small space just don't care that they're more focused on the crypto casino and accept

The the the sort of empty unproven state of many of these tokens yeah and be go look at coin market cap five years ago as I said Aurora coin was number three at one stage and everyone thought it was going to be great and these things come

And go and it's gonna continue to happen again I don't to pick on something like Tron but you know look at what happened recently with Justin having to come out and apologize now our Chinese businesses

And people gonna look at that and go like oh I want to build on that infrastructure rather than you know if you're MIT US or something else and how you can't just keep going on for using use buying a few partnerships here and

There hiking up a project eventually people are sitting on coins that are gonna end up being worthless if you're not using them in the real world right and I think that's the final thing I wanted to talk to you about because this

Is going to be perhaps the most important part post discussion and in the next decade and that is proof of utility proof of genuine value when it comes to empirical evidence enterprise sectors governments or whatever sector

It is they need to show that they have an interest and that they can utilize this to really be to really build the economic prosperity of their own entity in the mainstream so what is there right now Alex that's proof that any of these

Can it work including you know BTC beyond the sov any of them at all where's the real proof that we can know that this whole blockchain centric philosophy is going to translate into proof yeah so I don't think anyone could

Argue that people aren't using Bitcoin everyday around the world as a store value or a payment system then we go down and we look at aetherium the ICO and the ability to raise money yes it turned into a bubble but that was a

Revolutionary concept and programmable you know smart contracts we now see defy really exploding you can take out a loan directly from your ledger hardware well you can earn interest I think insurance is one of the next big

Waves a lot of people are working on on a Furion so you can't argue that people aren't using some of these in the real world yeah as you go down that list and pretty quickly start to become a hundred percent about

Speculation and people not using tokens in the real world right so obviously you know your advice too many given that it is relatively speculative still would be what you know if they're engaging for the first time now listening to us what

Would your message be yeah so I had one of these moments we get a realization of the things you've been discussing and never put your finger on it where I'm setting up some of my parents friends now that are that different older

Demographic and they want to park ten thousand a hundred thousand of their accumulated wealth in Bitcoin and they they're just getting set up with Bitcoin learning how to use a hardware wallet they're not I'm not encouraging them to

Go invest in all coins or look down the list and that's why we're seeing dominance rise at the moment and then my advice is if you learn about a CRM or if you learn about an individual project maybe they're more familiar with the

Industry basic attention token Kaiba you know maybe they like some of these concepts and they can see working in their business model maybe invest half a percent of your crypto exposure into one of those projects because at the moment

That can turn into a larger percentage of you invest wisely but you have to acknowledge that it's pretty speculative in them absolutely and Alex it's really interesting because if you're letting people know who don't know anything

About crypto you give them that very macro analysis you give them the I guess what's easy you know for them to start to whatever is most palatable for them to start to understand that the inner workings I suppose later but then in

Someone in our position given again that you know a lot about the crypto convolution the collusion that's going on all the different sort of parties that can really support the outcomes of a set up itself do you ever worry that

Sometimes there's being back in engineering to really shape the beginnings of a start-up because of the pump and dump scenarios that we see play out sometimes yeah I think it's rife in the raising at the moment and the old

Coins and that's why it's been very off-putting and tell people to tread carefully and I don't really cover many of those projects on the channel now because I just like I said I just don't see that many good ideas I think the

Markets pretty saturated a lot of the time some of the other projects are already working on similar things or Bitcoin aetherium like coin will absorb good features if other projects do something

Well and it becomes tried and tested so yeah I think a lot of people have learned this already through one cycle they wish they hadn't have invested so much in things they didn't understand absolutely one made I knew I would learn

A lot from you having a chat with you it's been great to catch up with someone that I want to become friends with as well you are truly respected speaker in Australia for crypto digital assets for blockchain and obviously you're well

Known and respected right for the community that is the crypto sphere and I wish you always the very best because you know you really do have genuine genuine interest in education and you certainly are putting skin in the game

You know you literally they're showing that you're putting your money where your mouth is and you're participating wholly in this so kudos to you mate for everything you do you know thanks for having me on Brad and I know you really

Enjoy focusing on the tech and that as well so I think people are going to be drawn to those fundamentals and and the tech and the good guys win over the long term so yeah thanks mate and I'm hopefully we can catch up again and just

Do chapter 2 perhaps and really explore what comes off blockchain what comes of new startups and certainly you know what comes of some of these startups beyond the narrative BTC so that we can see more than just an ear Sophie or more

Than just potentially a global in a settlement system and we start to see integration in Enterprise really showcase what blockchain can do definitely I look forward to seeing where we are in the future and left to

Do a recap for sure thanks mate thanks guys you

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Live from the USA hoping you get paid every day this stuff boasts a Bitcoin the crease though of creeped up is avoid BK and if you don't like me you must no...
Okay come down here boom that would be picture-perfect beautiful guys look at this we actually have this candle come down right on this line right here right ab...
Wow you guys are going to want to check this out guys as you may know Bitcoin has decreased a few hundred dollars as of about midnight last night we have some i...
What's going on guys crypto jeremy here back with xrp video hope you guys had a fantastic day thank you guys so much for tuning in to another video today&#3...
Hello tokens and welcome to another video nice update now today's third of June and I'm looking at news that happened from 28th of May until today I alw...
hello it's Brad Lori or blockchain Brad and today we're speaking exclusively with icon many of you know it you've known it for years and they'r...
People what's going on this an update on Tron all right so the market right now market cap is 431 billion we've got a Bitcoin dominance roughly 34 perce...